1 00:00:05,190 --> 00:00:02,629 you're probably like what the hell who's 2 00:00:06,550 --> 00:00:05,200 who the hell is that guy 3 00:00:08,710 --> 00:00:06,560 but it is me 4 00:00:10,070 --> 00:00:08,720 it's the same old me 5 00:00:12,950 --> 00:00:10,080 um so 6 00:00:15,749 --> 00:00:12,960 we have a pretty cool 7 00:00:17,510 --> 00:00:15,759 show in the store today 8 00:00:19,269 --> 00:00:17,520 with a mr 9 00:00:22,230 --> 00:00:19,279 avi loeb 10 00:00:24,550 --> 00:00:22,240 who i am super excited to 11 00:00:27,830 --> 00:00:24,560 hang out with and talk to it's been a 12 00:00:30,710 --> 00:00:28,870 and 13 00:00:39,110 --> 00:00:30,720 there's a lot going on 14 00:00:41,110 --> 00:00:39,120 advisory committee he may or may not be 15 00:00:44,790 --> 00:00:41,120 a part of 16 00:00:46,389 --> 00:00:44,800 so i'm hoping to get into that with them 17 00:00:49,270 --> 00:00:46,399 and hopefully a lot of other stuff 18 00:00:53,189 --> 00:00:49,280 especially fresh off the washington math 19 00:00:55,430 --> 00:00:53,199 uh national cathedral event as well so 20 00:00:57,029 --> 00:00:55,440 um i'm glad you guys are here with us 21 00:00:59,110 --> 00:00:57,039 we're gonna talk shop 22 00:01:01,189 --> 00:00:59,120 uh hopefully doesn't yell at me because 23 00:01:03,430 --> 00:01:01,199 i'm not you know 24 00:01:05,910 --> 00:01:03,440 seti 25 00:01:08,550 --> 00:01:05,920 but uh we'll be back right after this 26 00:01:13,190 --> 00:01:08,560 with a fantastic interview 27 00:01:15,190 --> 00:01:13,200 t-minus ten nine eight seven six 28 00:01:16,390 --> 00:01:15,200 five 29 00:01:17,429 --> 00:01:16,400 three 30 00:01:18,469 --> 00:01:17,439 two 31 00:01:21,830 --> 00:01:18,479 one 32 00:01:31,190 --> 00:01:21,840 zero and liftoff of space shuttle 33 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:36,010 so 34 00:02:25,030 --> 00:01:53,880 [Music] 35 00:02:30,710 --> 00:02:28,790 yep so that's the intro uh without 36 00:02:32,949 --> 00:02:30,720 further ado i'm going to bring in the 37 00:02:36,550 --> 00:02:32,959 man the myth the legend 38 00:02:38,390 --> 00:02:36,560 um avi loeb how are you today sir doing 39 00:02:40,630 --> 00:02:38,400 great thank you sean 40 00:02:43,110 --> 00:02:40,640 yeah it's great to have you back 41 00:02:44,630 --> 00:02:43,120 so you've been kind of slow recently it 42 00:02:46,309 --> 00:02:44,640 seems like eh 43 00:02:48,150 --> 00:02:46,319 well a lot of interesting things are 44 00:02:50,070 --> 00:02:48,160 happening 45 00:02:52,390 --> 00:02:50,080 for example yesterday i was notified 46 00:02:55,350 --> 00:02:52,400 that my book extraterrestrial that came 47 00:02:57,670 --> 00:02:55,360 out in at the end of january is now uh 48 00:03:00,550 --> 00:02:57,680 selected as a bestseller in both the 49 00:03:02,550 --> 00:03:00,560 non-fiction and science category of all 50 00:03:03,990 --> 00:03:02,560 books this year 51 00:03:06,070 --> 00:03:04,000 in amazon 52 00:03:08,710 --> 00:03:06,080 at amazon and that has nothing to do 53 00:03:11,589 --> 00:03:08,720 with the fact that i met jeff bezos 54 00:03:13,990 --> 00:03:11,599 a week ago uh well you did kind of throw 55 00:03:15,750 --> 00:03:14,000 him some shade i i think you did you 56 00:03:18,550 --> 00:03:15,760 know you we can't be sending people to 57 00:03:20,869 --> 00:03:18,560 live out in outer space that's dangerous 58 00:03:22,550 --> 00:03:20,879 we got to be living on earth 59 00:03:24,229 --> 00:03:22,560 i heard that 60 00:03:25,350 --> 00:03:24,239 well you know 61 00:03:27,670 --> 00:03:25,360 i think 62 00:03:29,990 --> 00:03:27,680 if we look back at our history darwinian 63 00:03:31,030 --> 00:03:30,000 evolution selected 64 00:03:33,190 --> 00:03:31,040 us 65 00:03:36,390 --> 00:03:33,200 such that we will survive on the surface 66 00:03:38,710 --> 00:03:36,400 of this rock that we call home earth and 67 00:03:41,110 --> 00:03:38,720 then we are not equipped to survive for 68 00:03:43,910 --> 00:03:41,120 long periods of time in space and the 69 00:03:45,990 --> 00:03:43,920 distances between stars are so vast that 70 00:03:47,589 --> 00:03:46,000 you know it takes light four years to 71 00:03:50,390 --> 00:03:47,599 traverse the distance from the nearest 72 00:03:53,190 --> 00:03:50,400 star and uh tens of thousands of years 73 00:03:55,509 --> 00:03:53,200 to go across the milky way galaxy so any 74 00:03:57,750 --> 00:03:55,519 trip that we make to another star 75 00:04:00,309 --> 00:03:57,760 outside the solar system you know would 76 00:04:03,190 --> 00:04:00,319 they require many generations of people 77 00:04:05,589 --> 00:04:03,200 and if you just consider one person 78 00:04:07,350 --> 00:04:05,599 over a period of one year or a few years 79 00:04:09,270 --> 00:04:07,360 in space 80 00:04:12,229 --> 00:04:09,280 there could be severe damage to the 81 00:04:14,470 --> 00:04:12,239 human brain as a result of cosmic rays 82 00:04:16,870 --> 00:04:14,480 unless you protect humans in some 83 00:04:19,670 --> 00:04:16,880 special and that that issue of 84 00:04:21,349 --> 00:04:19,680 the health of human astronauts out there 85 00:04:23,350 --> 00:04:21,359 not protected by 86 00:04:26,070 --> 00:04:23,360 the magnetic field of the earth that was 87 00:04:28,550 --> 00:04:26,080 not attended to so when when elon musk 88 00:04:31,670 --> 00:04:28,560 or jeff bezos talked about sending 89 00:04:34,150 --> 00:04:31,680 millions of people to space or going and 90 00:04:37,030 --> 00:04:34,160 uh you know settling on mars 91 00:04:38,710 --> 00:04:37,040 i think it's very naive and until we 92 00:04:41,189 --> 00:04:38,720 check whether humans can survive out 93 00:04:43,909 --> 00:04:41,199 there uh we we don't want to send people 94 00:04:46,150 --> 00:04:43,919 to their death and the point is 95 00:04:48,230 --> 00:04:46,160 we don't need them too we don't need to 96 00:04:50,070 --> 00:04:48,240 because we can send equipment you see 97 00:04:52,310 --> 00:04:50,080 now we have ai 98 00:04:54,870 --> 00:04:52,320 systems artificial intelligence systems 99 00:04:56,710 --> 00:04:54,880 that drive cars and of course taxi 100 00:04:58,950 --> 00:04:56,720 drivers are worried about their future 101 00:05:00,550 --> 00:04:58,960 job opportunities and so forth but but 102 00:05:02,629 --> 00:05:00,560 think about the possibility that within 103 00:05:06,870 --> 00:05:02,639 a decade we'll start sending 104 00:05:09,670 --> 00:05:06,880 ai astronauts these are uh 105 00:05:11,430 --> 00:05:09,680 these are smart devices that are 106 00:05:13,189 --> 00:05:11,440 autonomous they can decide for 107 00:05:15,590 --> 00:05:13,199 themselves after you train them through 108 00:05:18,070 --> 00:05:15,600 machine learning they would be able to 109 00:05:20,150 --> 00:05:18,080 act as astronauts or even better than 110 00:05:22,070 --> 00:05:20,160 astronauts because you know astronauts 111 00:05:25,029 --> 00:05:22,080 are vulnerable to 112 00:05:27,029 --> 00:05:25,039 various things and these um 113 00:05:28,790 --> 00:05:27,039 systems will be made of electronics you 114 00:05:31,749 --> 00:05:28,800 know they can survive a long time in 115 00:05:34,230 --> 00:05:31,759 space they can go outside the solar 116 00:05:37,430 --> 00:05:34,240 system so my point is let's think of 117 00:05:39,670 --> 00:05:37,440 them as our technological kids you see 118 00:05:41,909 --> 00:05:39,680 i was on in a forum just a few weeks ago 119 00:05:44,469 --> 00:05:41,919 where someone said i'm really worried 120 00:05:46,790 --> 00:05:44,479 about the future of ai because you know 121 00:05:49,670 --> 00:05:46,800 if we give too much authority to these 122 00:05:51,510 --> 00:05:49,680 intelligent systems we might regret it 123 00:05:52,469 --> 00:05:51,520 they might be having ways that we do not 124 00:05:55,830 --> 00:05:52,479 approve 125 00:05:57,909 --> 00:05:55,840 and i said to that person i said you 126 00:06:00,070 --> 00:05:57,919 you probably don't have kids because 127 00:06:01,990 --> 00:06:00,080 that's exactly the experience that you 128 00:06:03,749 --> 00:06:02,000 have when raising kids you know there is 129 00:06:05,990 --> 00:06:03,759 an early period where you educate the 130 00:06:07,270 --> 00:06:06,000 kids you give them the blueprint for how 131 00:06:09,270 --> 00:06:07,280 they should behave you know the 132 00:06:11,270 --> 00:06:09,280 different circumstances but then you let 133 00:06:13,029 --> 00:06:11,280 them loose and they go into the world 134 00:06:15,110 --> 00:06:13,039 and you never know sometimes they do 135 00:06:18,710 --> 00:06:15,120 things that you do not approve but 136 00:06:20,629 --> 00:06:18,720 that's a fact of life you know and um 137 00:06:23,749 --> 00:06:20,639 and and the same should be 138 00:06:26,550 --> 00:06:23,759 uh our approach to to those ai 139 00:06:28,070 --> 00:06:26,560 systems that learn from experience 140 00:06:29,670 --> 00:06:28,080 through machine learning you know so we 141 00:06:32,150 --> 00:06:29,680 can uh uh 142 00:06:33,990 --> 00:06:32,160 educate them early on but then we send 143 00:06:36,070 --> 00:06:34,000 them to the world and we should be 144 00:06:39,189 --> 00:06:36,080 relaxed about it just like we are 145 00:06:41,189 --> 00:06:39,199 relaxed about allowing our kids to uh 146 00:06:42,309 --> 00:06:41,199 function autonomously i mean 147 00:06:44,790 --> 00:06:42,319 all these 148 00:06:46,550 --> 00:06:44,800 helicopter parents you know that try to 149 00:06:49,589 --> 00:06:46,560 make sure the kid does exactly what they 150 00:06:52,550 --> 00:06:49,599 want the kid to do they feel they fail 151 00:06:56,070 --> 00:06:52,560 it never works right i mean i love the 152 00:06:57,749 --> 00:06:56,080 idea of course my first thought is um 153 00:06:59,589 --> 00:06:57,759 you know will these 154 00:07:01,909 --> 00:06:59,599 ai robots 155 00:07:04,309 --> 00:07:01,919 have the ability to become well they 156 00:07:06,710 --> 00:07:04,319 will be smart more smart than us but 157 00:07:09,670 --> 00:07:06,720 um can't will they turn on us you know 158 00:07:11,189 --> 00:07:09,680 is is um that a possibility i mean 159 00:07:12,309 --> 00:07:11,199 people hack everything all the time 160 00:07:16,070 --> 00:07:12,319 right 161 00:07:19,270 --> 00:07:16,080 yeah well it's something of course to uh 162 00:07:21,189 --> 00:07:19,280 monitor and have some rules uh 163 00:07:22,629 --> 00:07:21,199 you can always unplug them from the wall 164 00:07:25,110 --> 00:07:22,639 you know 165 00:07:27,029 --> 00:07:25,120 one thing i want to mention is um 166 00:07:29,029 --> 00:07:27,039 you know these are um 167 00:07:30,710 --> 00:07:29,039 systems that could actually help the 168 00:07:31,830 --> 00:07:30,720 progress of science 169 00:07:32,710 --> 00:07:31,840 because 170 00:07:39,029 --> 00:07:32,720 um 171 00:07:41,670 --> 00:07:39,039 vulnerable to 172 00:07:44,469 --> 00:07:41,680 their ego they try to portray an image 173 00:07:45,749 --> 00:07:44,479 that will promote them and they 174 00:07:48,230 --> 00:07:45,759 do not 175 00:07:50,070 --> 00:07:48,240 pay much attention to anomalies because 176 00:07:51,029 --> 00:07:50,080 that would disprove notions that they 177 00:07:53,189 --> 00:07:51,039 had 178 00:07:55,830 --> 00:07:53,199 they have a prejudice you know there are 179 00:07:57,110 --> 00:07:55,840 lots of faults that the human scientists 180 00:07:59,189 --> 00:07:57,120 have 181 00:08:01,589 --> 00:07:59,199 and we see that and because of that 182 00:08:03,909 --> 00:08:01,599 science is not progressing as fast as it 183 00:08:05,909 --> 00:08:03,919 could now imagine an ai system that 184 00:08:08,309 --> 00:08:05,919 serves as a scientist you feed it with 185 00:08:11,270 --> 00:08:08,319 data and if it sees an object that 186 00:08:14,309 --> 00:08:11,280 doesn't look like a comet or an asteroid 187 00:08:17,270 --> 00:08:14,319 called muammua then that air system will 188 00:08:19,830 --> 00:08:17,280 say look this is strange i don't care 189 00:08:21,510 --> 00:08:19,840 whether i'm regarded as an expert or not 190 00:08:23,589 --> 00:08:21,520 exactly ai system will say that's 191 00:08:25,510 --> 00:08:23,599 strange now if the ai system will be 192 00:08:28,469 --> 00:08:25,520 informed about another object called 193 00:08:30,469 --> 00:08:28,479 2020 so that exhibited the same 194 00:08:32,790 --> 00:08:30,479 qualities as 195 00:08:34,389 --> 00:08:32,800 and ended up being produced by us you 196 00:08:37,350 --> 00:08:34,399 know we know that it was a rocket 197 00:08:41,509 --> 00:08:37,360 booster then that ai system will say 198 00:08:44,790 --> 00:08:41,519 omuamua looks like 20 20 so therefore 199 00:08:47,430 --> 00:08:44,800 it's possible that it is artificial and 200 00:08:51,030 --> 00:08:47,440 these are kinds of deductions that do 201 00:08:53,430 --> 00:08:51,040 not hurt the ego of the ai system so 202 00:08:55,910 --> 00:08:53,440 aside from that ai systems could manage 203 00:08:58,150 --> 00:08:55,920 much larger data sets you know our human 204 00:09:01,910 --> 00:08:58,160 brain is limited so i 205 00:09:04,470 --> 00:09:01,920 imagine a future in science that 206 00:09:07,110 --> 00:09:04,480 will move forward much faster 207 00:09:08,630 --> 00:09:07,120 will make discoveries much quicker 208 00:09:11,430 --> 00:09:08,640 simply because 209 00:09:12,790 --> 00:09:11,440 uh human weaknesses are not 210 00:09:14,150 --> 00:09:12,800 slowing down 211 00:09:16,630 --> 00:09:14,160 the progress 212 00:09:18,710 --> 00:09:16,640 it will be ai scientists of course you 213 00:09:20,870 --> 00:09:18,720 don't want to give them tenure because 214 00:09:22,710 --> 00:09:20,880 they you know these ai systems can last 215 00:09:25,110 --> 00:09:22,720 for millions of years and then you will 216 00:09:25,990 --> 00:09:25,120 fill all the positions in academia i 217 00:09:27,810 --> 00:09:26,000 mean 218 00:09:29,670 --> 00:09:27,820 perhaps academia should be abolished 219 00:09:32,230 --> 00:09:29,680 [Laughter] 220 00:09:33,430 --> 00:09:32,240 yeah i mean you you make a great point i 221 00:09:36,389 --> 00:09:33,440 mean 222 00:09:38,230 --> 00:09:36,399 considering if they don't make a find of 223 00:09:40,150 --> 00:09:38,240 one thing or another they won't cry 224 00:09:42,710 --> 00:09:40,160 about it they won't lose a paycheck they 225 00:09:44,389 --> 00:09:42,720 won't starve there's there's a lot of 226 00:09:46,230 --> 00:09:44,399 things that go into that it's a 227 00:09:48,310 --> 00:09:46,240 fantastic idea 228 00:09:50,630 --> 00:09:48,320 as we see you know there's a recent clip 229 00:09:53,590 --> 00:09:50,640 of you speaking with someone from seti 230 00:09:55,190 --> 00:09:53,600 um and they're they were upset with you 231 00:09:57,990 --> 00:09:55,200 because you 232 00:10:00,790 --> 00:09:58,000 um they thought you uh through the whole 233 00:10:01,990 --> 00:10:00,800 scientific community under the bus 234 00:10:03,910 --> 00:10:02,000 um and 235 00:10:05,430 --> 00:10:03,920 you know it kind of reminded me of when 236 00:10:07,670 --> 00:10:05,440 i got in trouble in high school and a 237 00:10:10,389 --> 00:10:07,680 principal would tell me excuse me sir 238 00:10:13,110 --> 00:10:10,399 you can't do that sir um and you just 239 00:10:15,350 --> 00:10:13,120 railroaded through there with um you 240 00:10:17,350 --> 00:10:15,360 know great points about really when it 241 00:10:19,509 --> 00:10:17,360 comes down to it just bullying small 242 00:10:21,030 --> 00:10:19,519 mindedness 243 00:10:23,269 --> 00:10:21,040 let me explain my point of view my 244 00:10:25,829 --> 00:10:23,279 character is basically trying to help 245 00:10:27,910 --> 00:10:25,839 the city community i'm saying right you 246 00:10:29,269 --> 00:10:27,920 are not treated right you didn't get 247 00:10:30,630 --> 00:10:29,279 enough funding 248 00:10:33,030 --> 00:10:30,640 you know you should be more worried 249 00:10:34,870 --> 00:10:33,040 about it and ask for a thousand times 250 00:10:37,910 --> 00:10:34,880 more funding because if you look at 251 00:10:39,269 --> 00:10:37,920 parts of the mainstream in astronomy uh 252 00:10:42,150 --> 00:10:39,279 or physics 253 00:10:43,990 --> 00:10:42,160 an example is the search for dark matter 254 00:10:46,230 --> 00:10:44,000 we don't know what most of the matter is 255 00:10:49,110 --> 00:10:46,240 in the universe is made of so when i 256 00:10:51,430 --> 00:10:49,120 started astrophysics about uh 257 00:10:54,470 --> 00:10:51,440 almost 40 years ago 258 00:10:56,069 --> 00:10:54,480 the most popular view was maybe the dark 259 00:10:58,150 --> 00:10:56,079 matter is made of weakly interacting 260 00:11:00,069 --> 00:10:58,160 massive particles that's one type of 261 00:11:01,829 --> 00:11:00,079 particles and then hundreds of millions 262 00:11:04,630 --> 00:11:01,839 of dollars were invested in searching 263 00:11:06,870 --> 00:11:04,640 for those we haven't found them now the 264 00:11:08,870 --> 00:11:06,880 limits are very tight relative to the 265 00:11:10,230 --> 00:11:08,880 original numbers where we expected those 266 00:11:11,030 --> 00:11:10,240 particles to be 267 00:11:13,030 --> 00:11:11,040 so 268 00:11:15,190 --> 00:11:13,040 after 40 years hundreds of millions of 269 00:11:16,790 --> 00:11:15,200 dollars we haven't learned anything we 270 00:11:19,990 --> 00:11:16,800 just know that they are not 271 00:11:21,750 --> 00:11:20,000 those particles now my point is 272 00:11:23,670 --> 00:11:21,760 you know without 273 00:11:25,350 --> 00:11:23,680 investing similar amounts of money in 274 00:11:28,230 --> 00:11:25,360 the search for equipment from other 275 00:11:30,710 --> 00:11:28,240 civilizations we will never know if if 276 00:11:33,509 --> 00:11:30,720 there are things flying in space so when 277 00:11:34,949 --> 00:11:33,519 people ask for extraordinary evidence 278 00:11:37,350 --> 00:11:34,959 you know that's impossible unless you 279 00:11:39,509 --> 00:11:37,360 put the funds to search for the these 280 00:11:41,430 --> 00:11:39,519 things right and and 281 00:11:44,230 --> 00:11:41,440 it's a circular argument to say i don't 282 00:11:45,990 --> 00:11:44,240 have extraordinary evidence therefore 283 00:11:49,110 --> 00:11:46,000 we should not discuss this possibility 284 00:11:51,590 --> 00:11:49,120 because in my book actually in the real 285 00:11:54,389 --> 00:11:51,600 book the search for 286 00:11:55,829 --> 00:11:54,399 technological equipment in space is much 287 00:11:57,750 --> 00:11:55,839 less speculative than the search for 288 00:12:00,550 --> 00:11:57,760 dark matter because we know that we are 289 00:12:03,350 --> 00:12:00,560 doing it we know that other planets like 290 00:12:05,110 --> 00:12:03,360 the earth are very common around stars 291 00:12:06,710 --> 00:12:05,120 like the sun and we know that most of 292 00:12:09,269 --> 00:12:06,720 those stars from billions of years 293 00:12:11,590 --> 00:12:09,279 before us right before before the solar 294 00:12:13,269 --> 00:12:11,600 system so in that sense you know there 295 00:12:15,190 --> 00:12:13,279 there could have been technological 296 00:12:17,829 --> 00:12:15,200 civilizations far more advanced than we 297 00:12:20,310 --> 00:12:17,839 are that predated us and sent equipment 298 00:12:22,550 --> 00:12:20,320 let's check and so 299 00:12:25,030 --> 00:12:22,560 that's the goal of the galileo project 300 00:12:27,910 --> 00:12:25,040 that i established back in july this 301 00:12:30,069 --> 00:12:27,920 year thanks to donations from 302 00:12:31,590 --> 00:12:30,079 wealthy individuals and 303 00:12:34,069 --> 00:12:31,600 you know 304 00:12:36,069 --> 00:12:34,079 by now we have more than 100 sorry 305 00:12:38,310 --> 00:12:36,079 wasn't me 306 00:12:40,870 --> 00:12:38,320 we have more than a hundred scientists 307 00:12:43,509 --> 00:12:40,880 engaged in it and we're making great 308 00:12:45,670 --> 00:12:43,519 progress we're buying equipment 309 00:12:49,350 --> 00:12:45,680 instruments that would allow us to 310 00:12:51,509 --> 00:12:49,360 uh get more data on objects near earth 311 00:12:52,470 --> 00:12:51,519 that may have been extraterrestrial in 312 00:12:54,710 --> 00:12:52,480 origin 313 00:12:57,190 --> 00:12:54,720 and my point is that 314 00:12:59,509 --> 00:12:57,200 if in 40 years we will put hundreds of 315 00:13:01,350 --> 00:12:59,519 millions of dollars into this search and 316 00:13:03,750 --> 00:13:01,360 we will not find anything 317 00:13:05,590 --> 00:13:03,760 we will be in 40 years exactly at the 318 00:13:08,629 --> 00:13:05,600 same point where the dark matter 319 00:13:10,949 --> 00:13:08,639 searches are right now so how can that 320 00:13:12,550 --> 00:13:10,959 be part of the mainstream 321 00:13:14,069 --> 00:13:12,560 and uh 322 00:13:16,949 --> 00:13:14,079 the search for equipment from other 323 00:13:19,269 --> 00:13:16,959 civilizations not be and 324 00:13:21,750 --> 00:13:19,279 what i find strange is that the city 325 00:13:25,750 --> 00:13:21,760 community was not very welcoming 326 00:13:27,590 --> 00:13:25,760 uh to this notion and uh i felt that 327 00:13:29,509 --> 00:13:27,600 you know i'm trying to help them in a 328 00:13:30,710 --> 00:13:29,519 way because you know this is a method 329 00:13:31,750 --> 00:13:30,720 that was never 330 00:13:33,829 --> 00:13:31,760 used 331 00:13:35,430 --> 00:13:33,839 there was never a group of scientists 332 00:13:37,670 --> 00:13:35,440 searching for evidence of 333 00:13:39,910 --> 00:13:37,680 extraterrestrial equipment near earth 334 00:13:42,629 --> 00:13:39,920 and the galileo project is the first 335 00:13:45,670 --> 00:13:42,639 initiative that is scientific and not 336 00:13:48,069 --> 00:13:45,680 based on some anecdotal evidence that 337 00:13:49,590 --> 00:13:48,079 came from military personnel or from 338 00:13:52,310 --> 00:13:49,600 private citizens it's really a 339 00:13:54,870 --> 00:13:52,320 scientific project and the to me it 340 00:13:56,470 --> 00:13:54,880 sounded like this should be embraced by 341 00:13:59,350 --> 00:13:56,480 the city community this is something 342 00:14:00,629 --> 00:13:59,360 they should uh you know come together 343 00:14:03,509 --> 00:14:00,639 and help us 344 00:14:06,069 --> 00:14:03,519 and i you know and and i think we should 345 00:14:09,269 --> 00:14:06,079 invest 100 million dollars or more in 346 00:14:11,030 --> 00:14:09,279 this uh search and and and by the way 347 00:14:13,110 --> 00:14:11,040 you know i'm i'm getting a lot of 348 00:14:14,790 --> 00:14:13,120 support from the general public so there 349 00:14:16,870 --> 00:14:14,800 was this event in washington this 350 00:14:19,110 --> 00:14:16,880 international cathedral 351 00:14:21,670 --> 00:14:19,120 that was attended by the director of 352 00:14:24,949 --> 00:14:21,680 national intelligence say avril haines 353 00:14:27,030 --> 00:14:24,959 the head of nasa bill nelson 354 00:14:30,470 --> 00:14:27,040 and the blue origins 355 00:14:32,870 --> 00:14:30,480 jeff bezos and a theologian uh david 356 00:14:34,550 --> 00:14:32,880 wilkinson from durham university and at 357 00:14:37,189 --> 00:14:34,560 the end of the event 358 00:14:39,350 --> 00:14:37,199 um there was a very long line of people 359 00:14:40,310 --> 00:14:39,360 waiting to speak with me i was humbled 360 00:14:42,870 --> 00:14:40,320 by that 361 00:14:45,430 --> 00:14:42,880 um they were just waiting in line to 362 00:14:47,350 --> 00:14:45,440 speak with me and all they wanted to say 363 00:14:49,590 --> 00:14:47,360 there were more than 50 people and it 364 00:14:52,550 --> 00:14:49,600 took half an hour to go through the line 365 00:14:55,670 --> 00:14:52,560 all they each of them wanted to say 366 00:14:58,069 --> 00:14:55,680 is how inspirational and meaningful the 367 00:15:00,389 --> 00:14:58,079 galileo project is for them and they 368 00:15:01,590 --> 00:15:00,399 came from new jersey in new york city 369 00:15:02,790 --> 00:15:01,600 boston 370 00:15:04,470 --> 00:15:02,800 florida 371 00:15:07,350 --> 00:15:04,480 just to tell me that they wanted to meet 372 00:15:09,269 --> 00:15:07,360 me in person and that left 373 00:15:10,710 --> 00:15:09,279 an impression on me because i didn't 374 00:15:13,829 --> 00:15:10,720 realize you know since the pandemic 375 00:15:16,629 --> 00:15:13,839 started i never went out of town to a 376 00:15:18,150 --> 00:15:16,639 public event i didn't know that how much 377 00:15:20,230 --> 00:15:18,160 appreciation there is in the general 378 00:15:21,430 --> 00:15:20,240 public for this and 379 00:15:23,670 --> 00:15:21,440 you know the other thing that is 380 00:15:28,230 --> 00:15:23,680 happening that i should mention is in 381 00:15:29,910 --> 00:15:28,240 washington dc today the senate discussed 382 00:15:32,949 --> 00:15:29,920 an amendment 383 00:15:34,310 --> 00:15:32,959 first proposed by senator gillibrand 384 00:15:36,870 --> 00:15:34,320 that 385 00:15:38,310 --> 00:15:36,880 suggests to establish an office in 386 00:15:40,629 --> 00:15:38,320 government that would look into 387 00:15:43,189 --> 00:15:40,639 unidentified aerial phenomena the nature 388 00:15:44,790 --> 00:15:43,199 of them uh you know put together all the 389 00:15:46,069 --> 00:15:44,800 evidence that was collected over the 390 00:15:47,990 --> 00:15:46,079 years 391 00:15:50,710 --> 00:15:48,000 and there would be an advisory board and 392 00:15:51,670 --> 00:15:50,720 this advisory board will have 20 members 393 00:15:53,829 --> 00:15:51,680 and 394 00:15:57,509 --> 00:15:53,839 those 20 members you know three of them 395 00:16:00,150 --> 00:15:57,519 will be selected by the head of nasa 396 00:16:02,870 --> 00:16:00,160 and three of them will be selected by 397 00:16:05,509 --> 00:16:02,880 the director of the galileo project 398 00:16:07,110 --> 00:16:05,519 now you asked i didn't lobby for that i 399 00:16:08,790 --> 00:16:07,120 didn't go to washington 400 00:16:10,230 --> 00:16:08,800 right 401 00:16:12,230 --> 00:16:10,240 i'm just kidding 402 00:16:13,269 --> 00:16:12,240 no i'm telling you the truth i know i 403 00:16:15,430 --> 00:16:13,279 know 404 00:16:17,509 --> 00:16:15,440 by the way when you deal with me i you 405 00:16:19,189 --> 00:16:17,519 know you don't have to worry about i 406 00:16:21,350 --> 00:16:19,199 don't know he's saying one thing and the 407 00:16:22,949 --> 00:16:21,360 truth being somewhere i mean i basically 408 00:16:25,670 --> 00:16:22,959 tell you exactly 409 00:16:27,910 --> 00:16:25,680 what you what what what happened 410 00:16:30,069 --> 00:16:27,920 uh and i i did not lobby that was a 411 00:16:31,749 --> 00:16:30,079 surprise to me that i never spoke with 412 00:16:33,189 --> 00:16:31,759 senator billy brown i never spoke with 413 00:16:35,670 --> 00:16:33,199 anyone in washington about this 414 00:16:37,590 --> 00:16:35,680 amendment and it happened now what does 415 00:16:38,389 --> 00:16:37,600 it demonstrate it demonstrates first of 416 00:16:39,990 --> 00:16:38,399 all 417 00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:40,000 the same thing that i saw at the 418 00:16:44,550 --> 00:16:41,920 national cathedral that 419 00:16:47,670 --> 00:16:44,560 there is a lot of interest out there in 420 00:16:49,749 --> 00:16:47,680 the public in washington dc in what the 421 00:16:51,509 --> 00:16:49,759 galileo project is doing and and the 422 00:16:52,949 --> 00:16:51,519 fact that this subject was stigmatized 423 00:16:54,550 --> 00:16:52,959 in the past 424 00:16:57,990 --> 00:16:54,560 uh you know 425 00:17:00,790 --> 00:16:58,000 is over uh i think we are at a different 426 00:17:02,710 --> 00:17:00,800 phase now where this should become part 427 00:17:05,590 --> 00:17:02,720 of the scientific 428 00:17:07,189 --> 00:17:05,600 uh mainstream you know let's just as we 429 00:17:08,949 --> 00:17:07,199 search for the nature of dark matter 430 00:17:11,350 --> 00:17:08,959 let's search for the nature of 431 00:17:12,949 --> 00:17:11,360 unidentified flying objects the nature 432 00:17:14,630 --> 00:17:12,959 of objects like 433 00:17:16,390 --> 00:17:14,640 the first intestinal object that was 434 00:17:18,069 --> 00:17:16,400 discovered didn't look like a comet or 435 00:17:20,150 --> 00:17:18,079 an asteroid 436 00:17:22,549 --> 00:17:20,160 what's the problem in getting better 437 00:17:23,990 --> 00:17:22,559 data and figuring out it's not a 438 00:17:25,350 --> 00:17:24,000 philosophical question it's not 439 00:17:28,230 --> 00:17:25,360 something we should debate about and 440 00:17:30,230 --> 00:17:28,240 decide based on philosophical reasoning 441 00:17:33,029 --> 00:17:30,240 for the same reason that philosophers 442 00:17:35,350 --> 00:17:33,039 during the days of galileo galilei back 443 00:17:37,190 --> 00:17:35,360 you know four centuries ago they refused 444 00:17:39,750 --> 00:17:37,200 to look through his telescope but that 445 00:17:41,990 --> 00:17:39,760 was their mistake because they argued 446 00:17:43,990 --> 00:17:42,000 they know the sun moves around the earth 447 00:17:46,230 --> 00:17:44,000 and now you know we designed space 448 00:17:49,029 --> 00:17:46,240 mission on based on what galileo argued 449 00:17:50,870 --> 00:17:49,039 that the earth moves around the sun so 450 00:17:52,950 --> 00:17:50,880 that the fact that they put galileo in 451 00:17:54,950 --> 00:17:52,960 house arrest didn't change the 452 00:17:56,950 --> 00:17:54,960 trajectory of the earth it only 453 00:17:59,029 --> 00:17:56,960 maintained their ignorance and when we 454 00:18:01,350 --> 00:17:59,039 design space missions 455 00:18:02,870 --> 00:18:01,360 we remember galileo we don't remember 456 00:18:04,310 --> 00:18:02,880 these philosophers 457 00:18:07,350 --> 00:18:04,320 if they were today they would have 458 00:18:09,270 --> 00:18:07,360 canceled him on social media 459 00:18:11,909 --> 00:18:09,280 but the point is who cares about what 460 00:18:13,350 --> 00:18:11,919 they said reality is whatever it is you 461 00:18:14,390 --> 00:18:13,360 know if we don't look through our 462 00:18:16,549 --> 00:18:14,400 windows 463 00:18:18,549 --> 00:18:16,559 our neighbors will not go away yeah you 464 00:18:21,510 --> 00:18:18,559 say that one often and that's 465 00:18:22,390 --> 00:18:21,520 and it's very true it's perfect it it 466 00:18:24,070 --> 00:18:22,400 you know 467 00:18:25,590 --> 00:18:24,080 you need a cowboy attitude you need 468 00:18:27,750 --> 00:18:25,600 somebody like you to start the fire and 469 00:18:30,230 --> 00:18:27,760 i think that's exactly what you're doing 470 00:18:31,830 --> 00:18:30,240 with project galileo 471 00:18:33,510 --> 00:18:31,840 you have such big 472 00:18:35,830 --> 00:18:33,520 dreams and aspirations with it but 473 00:18:37,350 --> 00:18:35,840 you're also on the other hand open to 474 00:18:38,710 --> 00:18:37,360 whatever happens 475 00:18:40,789 --> 00:18:38,720 it's like 476 00:18:42,710 --> 00:18:40,799 if you don't make this shot if you don't 477 00:18:44,390 --> 00:18:42,720 take the shot you don't know if you're 478 00:18:46,630 --> 00:18:44,400 going to make it or miss and this has 479 00:18:48,470 --> 00:18:46,640 been going on you know i know you may 480 00:18:50,870 --> 00:18:48,480 not want to get into this but i 481 00:18:52,630 --> 00:18:50,880 personally know since the 40s we've been 482 00:18:54,710 --> 00:18:52,640 looking into this 483 00:18:56,470 --> 00:18:54,720 and things haven't gotten the proper 484 00:18:58,870 --> 00:18:56,480 budget or oversight 485 00:19:00,310 --> 00:18:58,880 and so you know some may want to have 486 00:19:02,470 --> 00:19:00,320 those complaints that we've been doing 487 00:19:04,310 --> 00:19:02,480 this for a while what's the difference 488 00:19:06,549 --> 00:19:04,320 the difference is it's public and 489 00:19:08,070 --> 00:19:06,559 there's oversight now you know you're 490 00:19:09,830 --> 00:19:08,080 doing it the right way 491 00:19:11,350 --> 00:19:09,840 also we have instruments that were never 492 00:19:13,669 --> 00:19:11,360 used before we didn't 493 00:19:15,510 --> 00:19:13,679 had a group of scientists looking into 494 00:19:17,750 --> 00:19:15,520 that they looked at data collected by 495 00:19:19,430 --> 00:19:17,760 other people by military personnel that 496 00:19:20,630 --> 00:19:19,440 you know the instruments used were not 497 00:19:23,510 --> 00:19:20,640 optimized 498 00:19:24,950 --> 00:19:23,520 so the point is uh there is this story 499 00:19:27,110 --> 00:19:24,960 about um 500 00:19:27,909 --> 00:19:27,120 you know the fishermen that went to sea 501 00:19:31,990 --> 00:19:27,919 and 502 00:19:34,390 --> 00:19:32,000 new law of nature that all fish are 503 00:19:35,510 --> 00:19:34,400 bigger than two inches and someone asked 504 00:19:37,350 --> 00:19:35,520 me 505 00:19:40,470 --> 00:19:37,360 what is the size of the hole in your 506 00:19:44,230 --> 00:19:42,070 so the point is in the past we were 507 00:19:46,310 --> 00:19:44,240 using fishing nets that are that have 508 00:19:49,909 --> 00:19:46,320 huge holes in them that we didn't have 509 00:19:52,390 --> 00:19:49,919 the instruments to see an object like 510 00:19:55,190 --> 00:19:52,400 that was only possible after 511 00:19:57,750 --> 00:19:55,200 the pan starch telescope was serving the 512 00:19:59,750 --> 00:19:57,760 sky starting in 2015 and this object was 513 00:20:02,390 --> 00:19:59,760 discovered in 2017 the size of a 514 00:20:04,390 --> 00:20:02,400 football field reflecting sunlight we 515 00:20:06,310 --> 00:20:04,400 couldn't see such objects before within 516 00:20:08,789 --> 00:20:06,320 the orbit of the earth around the sun so 517 00:20:11,590 --> 00:20:08,799 my point is when people when enrico 518 00:20:14,310 --> 00:20:11,600 fermi asked where is everybody you know 519 00:20:15,990 --> 00:20:14,320 that was very presumptuous because you 520 00:20:18,310 --> 00:20:16,000 know you can't just sit on the sofa at 521 00:20:21,029 --> 00:20:18,320 home and say nobody's looking for a door 522 00:20:22,710 --> 00:20:21,039 therefore i don't have neighbors 523 00:20:24,310 --> 00:20:22,720 the other thing is during the days of 524 00:20:26,310 --> 00:20:24,320 enrico fermi we didn't have the 525 00:20:27,750 --> 00:20:26,320 instruments that allow us to find things 526 00:20:29,270 --> 00:20:27,760 right now 527 00:20:31,830 --> 00:20:29,280 therefore we should use the 528 00:20:33,909 --> 00:20:31,840 state-of-the-art instrumentation use the 529 00:20:35,830 --> 00:20:33,919 scientific method and it's a phishing 530 00:20:36,710 --> 00:20:35,840 expedition we don't know what we will 531 00:20:38,070 --> 00:20:36,720 find 532 00:20:39,990 --> 00:20:38,080 you know and 533 00:20:42,549 --> 00:20:40,000 the galileo team will 534 00:20:44,950 --> 00:20:42,559 provide the data openly to anyone that 535 00:20:47,270 --> 00:20:44,960 wants to look at it and whatever we find 536 00:20:49,430 --> 00:20:47,280 we will report and if we find only 537 00:20:52,070 --> 00:20:49,440 sardines in our fishing net you know 538 00:20:57,190 --> 00:20:52,080 these are objects that are either birds 539 00:20:58,230 --> 00:20:57,200 or uh drones or airplanes so be it uh if 540 00:20:59,990 --> 00:20:58,240 it's um 541 00:21:02,470 --> 00:21:00,000 you know drones that 542 00:21:05,669 --> 00:21:02,480 say made in china made in russia on them 543 00:21:07,029 --> 00:21:05,679 i i told the avril haynes 544 00:21:09,029 --> 00:21:07,039 be glad to transfer the data 545 00:21:11,510 --> 00:21:09,039 automatically without even looking at it 546 00:21:13,750 --> 00:21:11,520 because it's as boring as birds are as 547 00:21:16,070 --> 00:21:13,760 far as i'm concerned and you know if we 548 00:21:16,950 --> 00:21:16,080 have a high resolution image of a bird i 549 00:21:18,789 --> 00:21:16,960 will 550 00:21:21,110 --> 00:21:18,799 gladly transfer the information to a 551 00:21:23,590 --> 00:21:21,120 zoologist 552 00:21:26,789 --> 00:21:23,600 what we look for are other things things 553 00:21:27,590 --> 00:21:26,799 that do not really look like human made 554 00:21:31,590 --> 00:21:27,600 or 555 00:21:34,870 --> 00:21:31,600 something that i thought was interesting 556 00:21:37,909 --> 00:21:34,880 uh at one point and it it was more of 557 00:21:39,830 --> 00:21:37,919 the idea of artifacts left over from a 558 00:21:41,669 --> 00:21:39,840 different time from possibly another 559 00:21:42,470 --> 00:21:41,679 species or being 560 00:21:44,070 --> 00:21:42,480 um 561 00:21:45,510 --> 00:21:44,080 you know and that does make more sense 562 00:21:47,590 --> 00:21:45,520 that gets back to what we kind of 563 00:21:49,750 --> 00:21:47,600 already touched on but you know we're on 564 00:21:51,270 --> 00:21:49,760 mars we have a helicopter we have a 565 00:21:54,789 --> 00:21:51,280 thing the size of a 566 00:21:56,789 --> 00:21:54,799 range rover on mars and the ego comes in 567 00:21:58,950 --> 00:21:56,799 and says we're the only ones that can do 568 00:22:01,669 --> 00:21:58,960 that it's it's quite ridiculous let me 569 00:22:03,909 --> 00:22:01,679 ask you this no amino acids are even 570 00:22:06,789 --> 00:22:03,919 prevalent in outer space just as much as 571 00:22:09,590 --> 00:22:06,799 they are here wouldn't that mean that 572 00:22:10,390 --> 00:22:09,600 life could be just as prevalent there as 573 00:22:12,310 --> 00:22:10,400 well 574 00:22:14,549 --> 00:22:12,320 it could be um i should say that the 575 00:22:16,549 --> 00:22:14,559 perseverance rover which is a robot 576 00:22:19,350 --> 00:22:16,559 basically on the surface of mars right 577 00:22:22,470 --> 00:22:19,360 now searching for microbes you know is 578 00:22:23,909 --> 00:22:22,480 giving a fuzzy warm feeling to everyone 579 00:22:26,390 --> 00:22:23,919 because if we find evidence that 580 00:22:28,710 --> 00:22:26,400 microbes existed we can still feel 581 00:22:30,710 --> 00:22:28,720 superior relative to them 582 00:22:33,350 --> 00:22:30,720 we are more intelligent who cares you 583 00:22:35,430 --> 00:22:33,360 know like we are still dominant but 584 00:22:38,070 --> 00:22:35,440 imagine the rover bumping into the 585 00:22:39,750 --> 00:22:38,080 wreckage of a spacecraft that we didn't 586 00:22:41,909 --> 00:22:39,760 produce that is far more advanced than 587 00:22:43,590 --> 00:22:41,919 anything we produced that would be a 588 00:22:45,750 --> 00:22:43,600 blow to our ego 589 00:22:47,110 --> 00:22:45,760 many people would not like to hear that 590 00:22:49,350 --> 00:22:47,120 yeah and 591 00:22:51,510 --> 00:22:49,360 you know in a way 592 00:22:53,510 --> 00:22:51,520 that's what equipment in space would 593 00:22:56,310 --> 00:22:53,520 mean that we are not the smartest kid on 594 00:22:59,270 --> 00:22:56,320 the block and that's why some people ha 595 00:23:01,830 --> 00:22:59,280 resist that notion but my point is when 596 00:23:03,990 --> 00:23:01,840 i took my daughters to the kindergarten 597 00:23:05,669 --> 00:23:04,000 they didn't like the fact that there are 598 00:23:08,310 --> 00:23:05,679 smarter kids 599 00:23:10,230 --> 00:23:08,320 on the block but they got used to it 600 00:23:12,870 --> 00:23:10,240 they learn from these kids so 601 00:23:14,950 --> 00:23:12,880 yeah by ignoring a smarter kid on our 602 00:23:17,029 --> 00:23:14,960 blog we are losing 603 00:23:18,950 --> 00:23:17,039 useful insights you know we can learn 604 00:23:20,789 --> 00:23:18,960 from them and then 605 00:23:23,029 --> 00:23:20,799 you know it's very likely that we are 606 00:23:25,110 --> 00:23:23,039 not the smartest 607 00:23:27,830 --> 00:23:25,120 because there are so many other planets 608 00:23:29,909 --> 00:23:27,840 with conditions similar to the 609 00:23:32,710 --> 00:23:29,919 on earth and you know if you just open 610 00:23:34,630 --> 00:23:32,720 recipe books you can get lots of cakes 611 00:23:36,950 --> 00:23:34,640 out of the same ingredients and what 612 00:23:39,909 --> 00:23:36,960 what make what makes us believe that 613 00:23:41,590 --> 00:23:39,919 we are the best cake possible um 614 00:23:43,830 --> 00:23:41,600 i would argue that probably we're sort 615 00:23:47,269 --> 00:23:43,840 of in the middle and there is something 616 00:23:49,510 --> 00:23:47,279 and in fact in in a recent 617 00:23:52,230 --> 00:23:49,520 essay i 618 00:23:54,549 --> 00:23:52,240 proposed classification of intelligent 619 00:23:55,990 --> 00:23:54,559 technological civilizations and i said 620 00:23:59,909 --> 00:23:56,000 we are probably 621 00:24:01,750 --> 00:23:59,919 class c because we are using um the 622 00:24:04,789 --> 00:24:01,760 energy from the sun so we are using 623 00:24:07,669 --> 00:24:04,799 whatever nature gave us in fact we are 624 00:24:10,630 --> 00:24:07,679 destroying our climate so we might be 625 00:24:12,549 --> 00:24:10,640 regarded as type d that is 626 00:24:14,870 --> 00:24:12,559 not even uh 627 00:24:16,310 --> 00:24:14,880 using what is given to it but 628 00:24:18,789 --> 00:24:16,320 destroying it 629 00:24:20,630 --> 00:24:18,799 and then there is class b which is a 630 00:24:23,190 --> 00:24:20,640 civilization that is more advanced than 631 00:24:25,269 --> 00:24:23,200 ours that creates you know a platform 632 00:24:29,510 --> 00:24:25,279 that it can live on 633 00:24:31,350 --> 00:24:29,520 that is not dependent on a star near it 634 00:24:34,230 --> 00:24:31,360 then it's independent it doesn't need 635 00:24:36,950 --> 00:24:34,240 the sun to warm it up it has one energy 636 00:24:38,789 --> 00:24:36,960 supply and then there is class a 637 00:24:41,110 --> 00:24:38,799 which can produce 638 00:24:41,830 --> 00:24:41,120 the conditions that led to its existence 639 00:24:44,549 --> 00:24:41,840 so 640 00:24:47,430 --> 00:24:44,559 the class a sterilizations for example 641 00:24:50,390 --> 00:24:47,440 could produce maybe a baby universe in 642 00:24:51,669 --> 00:24:50,400 the laboratory or well this life and and 643 00:24:53,750 --> 00:24:51,679 of course you know that would be 644 00:24:55,510 --> 00:24:53,760 remarkable if we ever meet such a thing 645 00:24:56,710 --> 00:24:55,520 because it will be an approximation to 646 00:24:58,870 --> 00:24:56,720 god 647 00:25:00,950 --> 00:24:58,880 exactly i i mean you beat me to it but i 648 00:25:02,710 --> 00:25:00,960 did want to ask you about that 649 00:25:05,110 --> 00:25:02,720 um at the 650 00:25:06,390 --> 00:25:05,120 national cathedral talk uh with the 651 00:25:10,149 --> 00:25:06,400 pastor or 652 00:25:12,789 --> 00:25:10,159 or theologian that was there um you said 653 00:25:14,390 --> 00:25:12,799 well let me provide a little twist 654 00:25:16,149 --> 00:25:14,400 um and it's genius 655 00:25:17,669 --> 00:25:16,159 it really is um 656 00:25:19,909 --> 00:25:17,679 because we are getting to the point 657 00:25:21,990 --> 00:25:19,919 where we can create 658 00:25:24,390 --> 00:25:22,000 you know another life another heart 659 00:25:26,870 --> 00:25:24,400 another limb why not 660 00:25:29,350 --> 00:25:26,880 another little tiny universe at one 661 00:25:30,710 --> 00:25:29,360 point i mean we're cloning things 662 00:25:34,230 --> 00:25:30,720 yeah i mean 663 00:25:37,590 --> 00:25:34,240 yeah we could be god 664 00:25:40,390 --> 00:25:37,600 well you see um in in religious 665 00:25:42,390 --> 00:25:40,400 uh texts god represents 666 00:25:44,149 --> 00:25:42,400 an entity that is 667 00:25:46,149 --> 00:25:44,159 capable of 668 00:25:47,430 --> 00:25:46,159 a lot of things and 669 00:25:49,750 --> 00:25:47,440 the point is 670 00:25:52,549 --> 00:25:49,760 we are making our way 671 00:25:54,470 --> 00:25:52,559 in that direction now uh as we develop 672 00:25:55,590 --> 00:25:54,480 our science and technology we are 673 00:25:57,430 --> 00:25:55,600 capable of 674 00:26:00,230 --> 00:25:57,440 accomplishing more 675 00:26:03,029 --> 00:26:00,240 and there might be a point where in our 676 00:26:06,230 --> 00:26:03,039 future where we will actually accomplish 677 00:26:08,549 --> 00:26:06,240 what religious texts attribute to god 678 00:26:11,510 --> 00:26:08,559 and my point is it's very useful to have 679 00:26:13,830 --> 00:26:11,520 these notions of what you know 680 00:26:16,549 --> 00:26:13,840 such a capable entity is because it 681 00:26:18,789 --> 00:26:16,559 gives us an ambition to approach that to 682 00:26:21,190 --> 00:26:18,799 approach it but if we ever get there you 683 00:26:23,029 --> 00:26:21,200 know if we are able to produce life 684 00:26:24,789 --> 00:26:23,039 synthetically in the laboratory if 685 00:26:26,549 --> 00:26:24,799 you're able to produce a baby universe 686 00:26:28,070 --> 00:26:26,559 in the laboratory things that were 687 00:26:30,710 --> 00:26:28,080 attributed to god 688 00:26:32,549 --> 00:26:30,720 then you can then reverse the argument 689 00:26:33,590 --> 00:26:32,559 and say okay maybe someone else did it 690 00:26:34,870 --> 00:26:33,600 already 691 00:26:35,830 --> 00:26:34,880 and then 692 00:26:37,909 --> 00:26:35,840 you know 693 00:26:40,310 --> 00:26:37,919 we might even learn about that someone 694 00:26:43,590 --> 00:26:40,320 else before we are able to get to that 695 00:26:45,990 --> 00:26:43,600 stage right and we are even 3d printing 696 00:26:48,789 --> 00:26:46,000 i heard somebody uh story about a 3d 697 00:26:50,549 --> 00:26:48,799 printed heart transplant 698 00:26:52,950 --> 00:26:50,559 some something like that and then you i 699 00:26:54,149 --> 00:26:52,960 mean you just put that together with ai 700 00:26:57,110 --> 00:26:54,159 i mean 701 00:26:59,990 --> 00:26:57,120 it's not difficult to imagine yeah yeah 702 00:27:01,350 --> 00:27:00,000 so actually if you want to have life as 703 00:27:03,669 --> 00:27:01,360 we know it 704 00:27:06,390 --> 00:27:03,679 on another planet far away you want to 705 00:27:09,350 --> 00:27:06,400 plant the seeds for that you you don't 706 00:27:12,549 --> 00:27:09,360 need to carry the seeds with you uh you 707 00:27:14,710 --> 00:27:12,559 can send an ai system with a 3d printer 708 00:27:16,870 --> 00:27:14,720 as long as you know how to make 709 00:27:19,430 --> 00:27:16,880 a synthetic life you might actually just 710 00:27:21,430 --> 00:27:19,440 send them and use the raw materials that 711 00:27:24,870 --> 00:27:21,440 are available over there and 712 00:27:26,710 --> 00:27:24,880 and make it um so you know we just our 713 00:27:30,230 --> 00:27:26,720 imagination is limited to what we 714 00:27:31,350 --> 00:27:30,240 accomplished so far but one way to 715 00:27:34,630 --> 00:27:31,360 expand 716 00:27:36,870 --> 00:27:34,640 our imagination is to find another 717 00:27:39,269 --> 00:27:36,880 technological civilization that is far 718 00:27:40,870 --> 00:27:39,279 ahead of us and i'm saying it will be 719 00:27:42,470 --> 00:27:40,880 beneficial for us it will give us a 720 00:27:43,510 --> 00:27:42,480 better perspective 721 00:27:46,470 --> 00:27:43,520 it will 722 00:27:47,430 --> 00:27:46,480 allow us to make a quantum leap into our 723 00:27:50,149 --> 00:27:47,440 future 724 00:27:52,149 --> 00:27:50,159 perhaps you know it will be like finding 725 00:27:54,870 --> 00:27:52,159 a package in the mail that has an 726 00:27:57,350 --> 00:27:54,880 important message inside of it of how 727 00:27:59,830 --> 00:27:57,360 uh to maintain our longevity how to keep 728 00:28:01,590 --> 00:27:59,840 our planet for a long time 729 00:28:03,909 --> 00:28:01,600 uh hospitable to the life that we are 730 00:28:05,909 --> 00:28:03,919 used to and if we just don't check our 731 00:28:08,470 --> 00:28:05,919 mailbox we're missing an important 732 00:28:10,950 --> 00:28:08,480 opportunity right and so um 733 00:28:12,710 --> 00:28:10,960 you know i think this subject has huge 734 00:28:14,230 --> 00:28:12,720 importance for the future of humanity if 735 00:28:17,190 --> 00:28:14,240 we find something 736 00:28:18,950 --> 00:28:17,200 it's also um not speculative in my view 737 00:28:20,070 --> 00:28:18,960 because we are sending equipment to 738 00:28:23,350 --> 00:28:20,080 space 739 00:28:25,590 --> 00:28:23,360 uh and i just find it really strange 740 00:28:27,190 --> 00:28:25,600 that it was not embraced by the 741 00:28:28,789 --> 00:28:27,200 mainstream of the scientific community 742 00:28:33,830 --> 00:28:28,799 given that the government talks about 743 00:28:37,669 --> 00:28:36,070 and given that the public funds science 744 00:28:40,630 --> 00:28:37,679 and the public is extremely excited 745 00:28:43,110 --> 00:28:40,640 about it it's a no-brainer i mean 746 00:28:45,510 --> 00:28:43,120 this must be considered as part of the 747 00:28:47,830 --> 00:28:45,520 mainstream well not you can kind of feel 748 00:28:50,710 --> 00:28:47,840 the frustration a lot of people have had 749 00:28:52,870 --> 00:28:50,720 in the ufo community for a long time 750 00:28:56,950 --> 00:28:52,880 you know so you're that's why you are 751 00:29:00,470 --> 00:28:58,549 the way i think of it is from the point 752 00:29:03,350 --> 00:29:00,480 of view of a scientist you see uh i 753 00:29:06,230 --> 00:29:03,360 understand um um so i'm not coming to it 754 00:29:09,190 --> 00:29:06,240 from the direction of um you know i saw 755 00:29:11,110 --> 00:29:09,200 something an unusual uh 756 00:29:12,789 --> 00:29:11,120 through my cell phone 757 00:29:14,389 --> 00:29:12,799 i'm coming to it from the point of view 758 00:29:16,789 --> 00:29:14,399 that you know this subject is too 759 00:29:18,710 --> 00:29:16,799 important for us to neglect it to ignore 760 00:29:21,190 --> 00:29:18,720 it and we have the capability to address 761 00:29:23,029 --> 00:29:21,200 it scientifically so we cannot really 762 00:29:25,190 --> 00:29:23,039 uh avoid it 763 00:29:26,549 --> 00:29:25,200 yeah no i understand and believe it or 764 00:29:28,310 --> 00:29:26,559 not there are people in the ufo 765 00:29:30,230 --> 00:29:28,320 community that think of it that way too 766 00:29:31,909 --> 00:29:30,240 i gotta say 767 00:29:33,350 --> 00:29:31,919 um and 768 00:29:35,830 --> 00:29:33,360 you know and you're completely right 769 00:29:37,350 --> 00:29:35,840 especially as something to learn from um 770 00:29:39,590 --> 00:29:37,360 don't we need teachers don't we need 771 00:29:41,590 --> 00:29:39,600 professors don't we need managers 772 00:29:44,630 --> 00:29:41,600 to guide us to teach us how to be the 773 00:29:46,950 --> 00:29:44,640 best we can be and how is it different 774 00:29:49,269 --> 00:29:46,960 than the scenario you put forth so i 775 00:29:51,110 --> 00:29:49,279 completely agree with you just to switch 776 00:29:52,470 --> 00:29:51,120 the um 777 00:29:53,430 --> 00:29:52,480 just to turn the tables just a little 778 00:29:55,669 --> 00:29:53,440 bit here 779 00:29:57,909 --> 00:29:55,679 um you know in this community everybody 780 00:30:00,070 --> 00:29:57,919 that's been watching um you know they 781 00:30:02,149 --> 00:30:00,080 love you and they love two other people 782 00:30:05,590 --> 00:30:02,159 too that you are now joined with which 783 00:30:08,549 --> 00:30:05,600 is uh chris mellon and lou elizondo came 784 00:30:11,830 --> 00:30:08,559 in as advisors i found it interesting 785 00:30:14,230 --> 00:30:11,840 because a loose famous clip um on cnn 786 00:30:16,230 --> 00:30:14,240 where we might not be alone 787 00:30:18,310 --> 00:30:16,240 um 788 00:30:20,549 --> 00:30:18,320 was on the screen 789 00:30:23,669 --> 00:30:20,559 during that interview and now here you 790 00:30:25,590 --> 00:30:23,679 are the synchronicity is unbelievable um 791 00:30:28,070 --> 00:30:25,600 how do you feel about that what made you 792 00:30:29,510 --> 00:30:28,080 go forth in in asking them to 793 00:30:32,470 --> 00:30:29,520 participate 794 00:30:33,990 --> 00:30:32,480 well you know great minds think alike um 795 00:30:37,350 --> 00:30:34,000 that's a phrase often used in the 796 00:30:39,909 --> 00:30:37,360 context of science and um i did 797 00:30:41,990 --> 00:30:39,919 you know they approached me actually 798 00:30:44,549 --> 00:30:42,000 and then i suggested to them when they 799 00:30:47,269 --> 00:30:44,559 approached me to discuss um 800 00:30:49,510 --> 00:30:47,279 you know some general things 801 00:30:51,669 --> 00:30:49,520 i suggested to them that if they are 802 00:30:52,789 --> 00:30:51,679 that they're welcome to join the galileo 803 00:30:54,630 --> 00:30:52,799 project because 804 00:30:56,149 --> 00:30:54,640 uh you know that's a scientific project 805 00:30:59,430 --> 00:30:56,159 that i think 806 00:31:01,669 --> 00:30:59,440 uh will shed the light on the question 807 00:31:05,269 --> 00:31:01,679 of what the nature of unidentified 808 00:31:08,310 --> 00:31:05,279 aerial phenomena is and and they were 809 00:31:10,870 --> 00:31:08,320 very um excited about the opportunity to 810 00:31:13,909 --> 00:31:10,880 join the galileo project and you know in 811 00:31:18,230 --> 00:31:13,919 the galileo project um i have a 812 00:31:19,990 --> 00:31:18,240 relatively wide tent where i allowed um 813 00:31:22,389 --> 00:31:20,000 chris mellon and 814 00:31:26,630 --> 00:31:22,399 lou alizondo and as well as 815 00:31:28,230 --> 00:31:26,640 skeptics uh such as michael shermer or 816 00:31:30,950 --> 00:31:28,240 um 817 00:31:33,509 --> 00:31:30,960 seth shostak and then 818 00:31:34,630 --> 00:31:33,519 you know the q i was asked why do i 819 00:31:37,269 --> 00:31:34,640 allow them 820 00:31:40,070 --> 00:31:37,279 and i said them you know because we will 821 00:31:42,789 --> 00:31:40,080 be eventually guided by the evidence so 822 00:31:46,710 --> 00:31:42,799 i don't care where people come from and 823 00:31:49,430 --> 00:31:46,720 i want to allow all opinions to be heard 824 00:31:51,669 --> 00:31:49,440 because it's not a a question of opinion 825 00:31:53,990 --> 00:31:51,679 you see uh if we collect date this is 826 00:31:56,710 --> 00:31:54,000 not a philosophical question of whether 827 00:31:58,470 --> 00:31:56,720 there is equipment near earth that came 828 00:32:00,070 --> 00:31:58,480 from another place it's a question that 829 00:32:02,870 --> 00:32:00,080 we can address using scientific 830 00:32:04,710 --> 00:32:02,880 instrumentation and um my point is that 831 00:32:06,630 --> 00:32:04,720 once we have good enough evidence 832 00:32:09,190 --> 00:32:06,640 everyone would agree if we have a high 833 00:32:10,470 --> 00:32:09,200 resolution image that demonstrates one 834 00:32:12,470 --> 00:32:10,480 way or another 835 00:32:14,470 --> 00:32:12,480 you know everyone would agree to it so i 836 00:32:17,509 --> 00:32:14,480 don't need people to agree to 837 00:32:19,590 --> 00:32:17,519 a particular notion in advance 838 00:32:21,669 --> 00:32:19,600 uh they will be convinced by the data 839 00:32:24,149 --> 00:32:21,679 and i want to hear everybody 840 00:32:26,470 --> 00:32:24,159 yeah and you know on a conversation i 841 00:32:27,509 --> 00:32:26,480 had on this channel this past sunday 842 00:32:30,310 --> 00:32:27,519 um 843 00:32:31,669 --> 00:32:30,320 we actually the topic came up where 844 00:32:33,190 --> 00:32:31,679 um 845 00:32:35,830 --> 00:32:33,200 you know something that would really hit 846 00:32:38,230 --> 00:32:35,840 a home with everybody is a scenario 847 00:32:40,389 --> 00:32:38,240 where a skeptic like shermer or a mick 848 00:32:41,269 --> 00:32:40,399 west or something actually changed their 849 00:32:44,870 --> 00:32:41,279 tune 850 00:32:47,190 --> 00:32:44,880 and said i think there is something here 851 00:32:49,430 --> 00:32:47,200 right um that would be dramatic so i 852 00:32:51,590 --> 00:32:49,440 think the way you set that up not you 853 00:32:54,230 --> 00:32:51,600 know maybe that's poor choice of words 854 00:32:58,070 --> 00:32:54,240 but the way that could be set up 855 00:33:00,310 --> 00:32:58,080 is absolutely perfect and genius that's 856 00:33:02,950 --> 00:33:00,320 yeah that's exactly the way i was 857 00:33:04,230 --> 00:33:02,960 thinking about it and uh you know the 858 00:33:05,990 --> 00:33:04,240 other thing is 859 00:33:07,990 --> 00:33:06,000 people that know me would tell you that 860 00:33:11,509 --> 00:33:08,000 then i don't care how many likes i get 861 00:33:12,950 --> 00:33:11,519 on twitter um i don't care the point is 862 00:33:15,350 --> 00:33:12,960 you know based on the experience of 863 00:33:17,509 --> 00:33:15,360 galileo and others throughout the 864 00:33:19,269 --> 00:33:17,519 history of science that eventually the 865 00:33:21,110 --> 00:33:19,279 truth comes out if you have good enough 866 00:33:23,909 --> 00:33:21,120 evidence and 867 00:33:25,830 --> 00:33:23,919 the the key here is to collect the 868 00:33:29,110 --> 00:33:25,840 evidence because what happens very often 869 00:33:30,710 --> 00:33:29,120 the big sin that the of of science is 870 00:33:33,110 --> 00:33:30,720 when people think they know the answer 871 00:33:34,230 --> 00:33:33,120 in advance and they don't collect the 872 00:33:37,509 --> 00:33:34,240 data 873 00:33:39,269 --> 00:33:37,519 and very often they prefer not to know 874 00:33:41,110 --> 00:33:39,279 so it's just like putting your head in 875 00:33:44,149 --> 00:33:41,120 the sand and not looking around and 876 00:33:46,470 --> 00:33:44,159 saying you know i can't see anything 877 00:33:48,710 --> 00:33:46,480 and that's not a good approach because 878 00:33:50,149 --> 00:33:48,720 we want to get a good sense of reality 879 00:33:52,389 --> 00:33:50,159 you see 880 00:33:53,990 --> 00:33:52,399 if you ignore reality it will come to 881 00:33:55,990 --> 00:33:54,000 haunt you eventually 882 00:33:57,990 --> 00:33:56,000 knowing whether we are alone or not 883 00:34:00,549 --> 00:33:58,000 knowing whether we have a smarter kid on 884 00:34:02,710 --> 00:34:00,559 the block would help us 885 00:34:06,230 --> 00:34:02,720 in terms of planning our 886 00:34:08,790 --> 00:34:06,240 future because we could learn about our 887 00:34:11,190 --> 00:34:08,800 environment we could learn how about how 888 00:34:12,710 --> 00:34:11,200 to behave and what kind of aspirations 889 00:34:14,869 --> 00:34:12,720 to have in space 890 00:34:17,109 --> 00:34:14,879 and we can learn from smarter kids on 891 00:34:18,470 --> 00:34:17,119 our block and you know scientifically 892 00:34:21,829 --> 00:34:18,480 technologically 893 00:34:24,230 --> 00:34:21,839 uh we can expand our imagination and 894 00:34:28,149 --> 00:34:24,240 the way i see it is that knowing reality 895 00:34:31,750 --> 00:34:28,159 is always better than ignoring it 896 00:34:34,149 --> 00:34:31,760 and you see it in many contexts 897 00:34:36,869 --> 00:34:34,159 yeah you do yeah not just this one this 898 00:34:38,790 --> 00:34:36,879 is almost uh an extreme example of a lot 899 00:34:40,869 --> 00:34:38,800 of personal situations that are just 900 00:34:43,109 --> 00:34:40,879 like that whether it's something like 901 00:34:43,909 --> 00:34:43,119 someone stealing from the store you own 902 00:34:45,829 --> 00:34:43,919 or 903 00:34:47,990 --> 00:34:45,839 you know anything like that 904 00:34:51,990 --> 00:34:48,000 if you ignore it it hurts you the best 905 00:34:53,829 --> 00:34:52,000 example i i i often give is that of 906 00:34:56,790 --> 00:34:53,839 you know bernie madoff 907 00:34:59,349 --> 00:34:56,800 he had a beautiful idea that you give 908 00:35:01,270 --> 00:34:59,359 him uh your money he will make more of 909 00:35:03,430 --> 00:35:01,280 it irrespective of what the stock market 910 00:35:05,829 --> 00:35:03,440 does and people found this idea 911 00:35:07,510 --> 00:35:05,839 beautiful they gave him their money they 912 00:35:11,109 --> 00:35:07,520 thought it's so great 913 00:35:12,470 --> 00:35:11,119 uh if they can always make more money 914 00:35:15,030 --> 00:35:12,480 you know there is nothing better than 915 00:35:17,670 --> 00:35:15,040 that so that was a beautiful idea 916 00:35:19,589 --> 00:35:17,680 they were happy giving him their money 917 00:35:21,750 --> 00:35:19,599 he was happy that they gave him their 918 00:35:23,910 --> 00:35:21,760 money everyone was happy 919 00:35:26,710 --> 00:35:23,920 now what's wrong with this story that 920 00:35:28,150 --> 00:35:26,720 when they asked for the money back 921 00:35:29,990 --> 00:35:28,160 he couldn't deliver 922 00:35:32,550 --> 00:35:30,000 and then he was put in jail this is 923 00:35:35,589 --> 00:35:32,560 called the ponzi scheme and that shows 924 00:35:37,510 --> 00:35:35,599 how important it is to do the experiment 925 00:35:38,550 --> 00:35:37,520 someone can tell you 926 00:35:43,190 --> 00:35:38,560 you know 927 00:35:45,190 --> 00:35:43,200 that there are extra dimensions that 928 00:35:46,630 --> 00:35:45,200 there there is the string theory 929 00:35:49,589 --> 00:35:46,640 multiverse 930 00:35:51,829 --> 00:35:49,599 uh you know that there is a landscape 931 00:35:53,589 --> 00:35:51,839 that you you cannot access all kinds of 932 00:35:56,310 --> 00:35:53,599 ideas that seem beautiful that are 933 00:35:59,190 --> 00:35:56,320 supported by fancy mathematics 934 00:36:00,470 --> 00:35:59,200 the key is not how beautiful they are 935 00:36:02,630 --> 00:36:00,480 the key is 936 00:36:04,630 --> 00:36:02,640 to design an experiment that will test 937 00:36:06,630 --> 00:36:04,640 whether they apply to reality that's 938 00:36:09,589 --> 00:36:06,640 that's what physics is about 939 00:36:12,230 --> 00:36:09,599 and it's being missed these days because 940 00:36:13,349 --> 00:36:12,240 there is a whole culture of physicists 941 00:36:16,310 --> 00:36:13,359 scientists 942 00:36:19,349 --> 00:36:16,320 that is preoccupied with the beauty of 943 00:36:21,030 --> 00:36:19,359 ideas with mathematical gymnastics 944 00:36:23,510 --> 00:36:21,040 because it's 945 00:36:25,270 --> 00:36:23,520 aiming at demonstrating 946 00:36:27,270 --> 00:36:25,280 that we are smart you know that people 947 00:36:28,069 --> 00:36:27,280 solve some complicated equations and 948 00:36:30,630 --> 00:36:28,079 then 949 00:36:32,150 --> 00:36:30,640 they are thought of as being very smart 950 00:36:33,670 --> 00:36:32,160 but that's not really the objective the 951 00:36:35,349 --> 00:36:33,680 objective is not to demonstrate that we 952 00:36:38,150 --> 00:36:35,359 are smart objective is to figure out 953 00:36:40,150 --> 00:36:38,160 reality and you know if umua is a piece 954 00:36:41,990 --> 00:36:40,160 of equipment that doesn't require very 955 00:36:43,910 --> 00:36:42,000 sophisticated math you just need a high 956 00:36:45,589 --> 00:36:43,920 resolution image you know they say a 957 00:36:47,270 --> 00:36:45,599 picture is worth a thousand words i 958 00:36:49,750 --> 00:36:47,280 don't and it's worth a thousand 959 00:36:53,190 --> 00:36:49,760 equations as well so if we had a picture 960 00:36:55,829 --> 00:36:53,200 of a moa and it looked like it has bolts 961 00:36:57,910 --> 00:36:55,839 screws buttons on it and it doesn't look 962 00:37:00,390 --> 00:36:57,920 like a rock then i wouldn't need to 963 00:37:02,870 --> 00:37:00,400 write my book that image would have been 964 00:37:05,589 --> 00:37:02,880 worth 66 000 words the number of words 965 00:37:07,510 --> 00:37:05,599 in my book i will need to write it and 966 00:37:10,150 --> 00:37:07,520 my point is it's it's not a matter of 967 00:37:11,030 --> 00:37:10,160 sophistication it's a question of what 968 00:37:16,630 --> 00:37:11,040 is 969 00:37:19,190 --> 00:37:16,640 natural or artificial and you know other 970 00:37:21,270 --> 00:37:19,200 scientists were saying no it's natural 971 00:37:23,430 --> 00:37:21,280 and i said why and then 972 00:37:25,109 --> 00:37:23,440 one of them said oh maybe it's a cloud 973 00:37:27,030 --> 00:37:25,119 of dust particles 974 00:37:29,270 --> 00:37:27,040 and then another one said maybe it's a 975 00:37:31,109 --> 00:37:29,280 chunk of frozen hydrogen 976 00:37:32,950 --> 00:37:31,119 we've never seen anything like those 977 00:37:35,349 --> 00:37:32,960 things and then someone said maybe it's 978 00:37:37,190 --> 00:37:35,359 a chunk of frozen nitrogen and all of 979 00:37:39,670 --> 00:37:37,200 these have problems and i wrote papers 980 00:37:41,270 --> 00:37:39,680 about it but my point is all of these 981 00:37:42,790 --> 00:37:41,280 suggestions were something that we've 982 00:37:45,109 --> 00:37:42,800 never seen before 983 00:37:46,950 --> 00:37:45,119 so if you are allowing yourself 984 00:37:48,630 --> 00:37:46,960 to imagine things that we've never seen 985 00:37:50,230 --> 00:37:48,640 before and you claim that you know for 986 00:37:51,829 --> 00:37:50,240 sure that it's natural that's 987 00:37:53,349 --> 00:37:51,839 inconsistent because it may be 988 00:37:55,829 --> 00:37:53,359 artificial it's also something we've 989 00:37:57,670 --> 00:37:55,839 never seen before and you know when a 990 00:38:00,230 --> 00:37:57,680 caveman finds a cell phone the caveman 991 00:38:02,390 --> 00:38:00,240 would argue it's a rock of a type that 992 00:38:03,589 --> 00:38:02,400 i've never heard before and so that is 993 00:38:05,750 --> 00:38:03,599 my 994 00:38:08,310 --> 00:38:05,760 you know we should not be preoccupied 995 00:38:10,550 --> 00:38:08,320 with uh prejudice we should just collect 996 00:38:12,390 --> 00:38:10,560 more data and get you know 997 00:38:14,150 --> 00:38:12,400 enough data enough evidence that will 998 00:38:16,550 --> 00:38:14,160 convince everyone about the nature of 999 00:38:18,870 --> 00:38:16,560 these objects let me ask you this though 1000 00:38:21,190 --> 00:38:18,880 if something comes into our solar system 1001 00:38:23,270 --> 00:38:21,200 again you know like 1002 00:38:24,790 --> 00:38:23,280 uh and you do get good photos what are 1003 00:38:26,950 --> 00:38:24,800 the chances that it would have things 1004 00:38:30,230 --> 00:38:26,960 like nuts and bolts or something that we 1005 00:38:32,870 --> 00:38:30,240 could familiarize with a machine 1006 00:38:35,829 --> 00:38:32,880 versus being something completely 1007 00:38:37,270 --> 00:38:35,839 unexpected that would continue to be 1008 00:38:39,990 --> 00:38:37,280 anomalous 1009 00:38:41,030 --> 00:38:40,000 right so um if you get a high-resolution 1010 00:38:43,190 --> 00:38:41,040 image 1011 00:38:44,550 --> 00:38:43,200 uh you can tell whether it's a rock 1012 00:38:46,630 --> 00:38:44,560 that's fundamentally the question you 1013 00:38:48,870 --> 00:38:46,640 see okay we can imagine only 1014 00:38:51,589 --> 00:38:48,880 technologies that we developed 1015 00:38:53,510 --> 00:38:51,599 right and you know the caveman is unable 1016 00:38:55,829 --> 00:38:53,520 to understand what a cell phone is this 1017 00:38:56,710 --> 00:38:55,839 is not something that the caveman knows 1018 00:38:59,109 --> 00:38:56,720 how 1019 00:39:00,710 --> 00:38:59,119 it's built you know and by the way if 1020 00:39:02,710 --> 00:39:00,720 you think about yourself you have a 1021 00:39:05,190 --> 00:39:02,720 heart you have a liver 1022 00:39:06,390 --> 00:39:05,200 you live with those things for decades 1023 00:39:08,790 --> 00:39:06,400 and you never 1024 00:39:10,390 --> 00:39:08,800 you were never asked to understand how 1025 00:39:12,150 --> 00:39:10,400 the heart operates in order for you to 1026 00:39:14,630 --> 00:39:12,160 live with these things so you know we 1027 00:39:17,030 --> 00:39:14,640 find things in reality that we don't 1028 00:39:19,349 --> 00:39:17,040 fully understand and the caveman seeing 1029 00:39:21,030 --> 00:39:19,359 a cell phone would not understand 1030 00:39:22,950 --> 00:39:21,040 what the cell phone is about you know 1031 00:39:25,829 --> 00:39:22,960 what it has in its guts 1032 00:39:28,550 --> 00:39:25,839 but it it's possible for the cavemen to 1033 00:39:30,790 --> 00:39:28,560 tell that the cell phone is not a rock 1034 00:39:33,030 --> 00:39:30,800 by pressing a button on it and recording 1035 00:39:35,430 --> 00:39:33,040 his voice and that would demonstrate 1036 00:39:37,589 --> 00:39:35,440 that it's not a rock so what we can do 1037 00:39:39,829 --> 00:39:37,599 is basically rule out 1038 00:39:41,829 --> 00:39:39,839 natural objects because we pretty much 1039 00:39:43,990 --> 00:39:41,839 we've seen rocks we've seen asteroids 1040 00:39:45,910 --> 00:39:44,000 we've seen comets we know how they look 1041 00:39:46,950 --> 00:39:45,920 we actually have a high resolution image 1042 00:39:49,990 --> 00:39:46,960 of 1043 00:39:52,870 --> 00:39:50,000 the asteroid bennu when the osiris-rex 1044 00:39:55,030 --> 00:39:52,880 mission landed on it so we know that you 1045 00:39:57,349 --> 00:39:55,040 know they look like rocks and if you see 1046 00:39:59,510 --> 00:39:57,359 something that doesn't look like that 1047 00:40:01,270 --> 00:39:59,520 you can tell that it's artificial 1048 00:40:03,510 --> 00:40:01,280 yeah even if you don't fully understand 1049 00:40:05,670 --> 00:40:03,520 the technology that stands behind it it 1050 00:40:08,630 --> 00:40:05,680 will well what would be the next step if 1051 00:40:10,950 --> 00:40:08,640 if you do capture something um you're 1052 00:40:14,230 --> 00:40:10,960 pretty sure you're positive it's not a 1053 00:40:16,550 --> 00:40:14,240 rock or an asteroid or anything um is is 1054 00:40:18,309 --> 00:40:16,560 the only analysis you can really do at 1055 00:40:19,349 --> 00:40:18,319 that point from the photos that you got 1056 00:40:20,230 --> 00:40:19,359 or whatever 1057 00:40:21,510 --> 00:40:20,240 yeah 1058 00:40:23,910 --> 00:40:21,520 you're working with 1059 00:40:26,069 --> 00:40:23,920 so the galileo project has two branches 1060 00:40:28,950 --> 00:40:26,079 one of them is to identify the nature of 1061 00:40:29,829 --> 00:40:28,960 unidentified aerial phenomena that's 1062 00:40:33,670 --> 00:40:29,839 that 1063 00:40:35,349 --> 00:40:33,680 in the report of the director of 1064 00:40:39,109 --> 00:40:35,359 national intelligence to congress on the 1065 00:40:41,430 --> 00:40:39,119 25th of june okay so that's one aspect 1066 00:40:43,829 --> 00:40:41,440 and for that we build telescope systems 1067 00:40:45,750 --> 00:40:43,839 on the ground that would look at the sky 1068 00:40:47,030 --> 00:40:45,760 and monitor and look for objects of 1069 00:40:49,109 --> 00:40:47,040 interest okay 1070 00:40:50,630 --> 00:40:49,119 now separate from that there is a branch 1071 00:40:51,990 --> 00:40:50,640 of the galileo project that looks for 1072 00:40:54,550 --> 00:40:52,000 objects like 1073 00:40:56,630 --> 00:40:54,560 the first intestinal object and the idea 1074 00:40:58,230 --> 00:40:56,640 is to design a space mission we already 1075 00:41:00,069 --> 00:40:58,240 have 1076 00:41:01,430 --> 00:41:00,079 good ideas about the parameters of such 1077 00:41:04,710 --> 00:41:01,440 a mission 1078 00:41:05,589 --> 00:41:04,720 that will carry a camera and intercept 1079 00:41:08,150 --> 00:41:05,599 the 1080 00:41:10,870 --> 00:41:08,160 trajectory of such an object and get a 1081 00:41:12,870 --> 00:41:10,880 close-up photograph of it it needs to 1082 00:41:15,829 --> 00:41:12,880 come within a thousand kilometers a 1083 00:41:19,030 --> 00:41:15,839 thousand miles or so from the object and 1084 00:41:21,190 --> 00:41:19,040 take a high-resolution image of it uh of 1085 00:41:23,589 --> 00:41:21,200 course what i would like to do is 1086 00:41:25,589 --> 00:41:23,599 put my hands on it 1087 00:41:28,390 --> 00:41:25,599 and press some buttons that would be 1088 00:41:29,349 --> 00:41:28,400 fantastic uh and 1089 00:41:31,109 --> 00:41:29,359 but 1090 00:41:33,030 --> 00:41:31,119 we may not be able to do it in the first 1091 00:41:34,470 --> 00:41:33,040 encounter if we could get a high 1092 00:41:36,950 --> 00:41:34,480 resolution image maybe in the next 1093 00:41:39,430 --> 00:41:36,960 encounter we we will land on it 1094 00:41:41,589 --> 00:41:39,440 uh you know in principle it might there 1095 00:41:43,349 --> 00:41:41,599 might be a meteor you know this is this 1096 00:41:45,030 --> 00:41:43,359 is an object that collides with the 1097 00:41:47,190 --> 00:41:45,040 earth and uh 1098 00:41:49,190 --> 00:41:47,200 there it may land on the ground and you 1099 00:41:51,589 --> 00:41:49,200 could examine it afterwards if it's some 1100 00:41:53,030 --> 00:41:51,599 piece of equipment you see 1101 00:41:54,950 --> 00:41:53,040 so um 1102 00:41:57,510 --> 00:41:54,960 i would really 1103 00:41:59,349 --> 00:41:57,520 want to figure out if we do find and by 1104 00:42:00,630 --> 00:41:59,359 the way it's enough to find one object 1105 00:42:02,870 --> 00:42:00,640 that is of extraterrestrial 1106 00:42:05,030 --> 00:42:02,880 technological origin for this to change 1107 00:42:06,309 --> 00:42:05,040 the future of humanity you don't need 1108 00:42:08,309 --> 00:42:06,319 it's possible that most of the 1109 00:42:09,589 --> 00:42:08,319 unidentified objects 1110 00:42:12,470 --> 00:42:09,599 in the past 1111 00:42:15,510 --> 00:42:12,480 had some mundane explanations 1112 00:42:17,990 --> 00:42:15,520 well then maybe 99.9 percent of them 1113 00:42:20,630 --> 00:42:18,000 were uh i don't care about them 1114 00:42:22,230 --> 00:42:20,640 it's sufficient to find one that is of 1115 00:42:24,870 --> 00:42:22,240 extraterrestrial technological origin 1116 00:42:26,790 --> 00:42:24,880 without a doubt for this to have a huge 1117 00:42:29,990 --> 00:42:26,800 impact on the way we think 1118 00:42:31,910 --> 00:42:30,000 and what we are aiming it at 1119 00:42:33,510 --> 00:42:31,920 you know we are casting our net it's a 1120 00:42:34,710 --> 00:42:33,520 fishing expedition we don't know what we 1121 00:42:37,510 --> 00:42:34,720 will find 1122 00:42:39,589 --> 00:42:37,520 and we are open-minded so the thing is 1123 00:42:41,750 --> 00:42:39,599 not to have a prejudice and to use the 1124 00:42:43,990 --> 00:42:41,760 best instruments possible and and by the 1125 00:42:46,470 --> 00:42:44,000 way a lot of times i'm asked well 1126 00:42:47,990 --> 00:42:46,480 astronomers look at the sky all the time 1127 00:42:49,670 --> 00:42:48,000 you know if there was something unusual 1128 00:42:52,150 --> 00:42:49,680 they would notice it 1129 00:42:54,230 --> 00:42:52,160 no that's not true because astronomers 1130 00:42:57,270 --> 00:42:54,240 look at very distant 1131 00:42:59,910 --> 00:42:57,280 objects far away and if a bird flies 1132 00:43:00,630 --> 00:42:59,920 above a telescope the astronomers ignore 1133 00:43:05,349 --> 00:43:00,640 it 1134 00:43:09,510 --> 00:43:05,359 yeah neil degrasse tyson said that same 1135 00:43:11,829 --> 00:43:09,520 exact thing on an interview 1136 00:43:13,430 --> 00:43:11,839 not too long ago he said i look you know 1137 00:43:15,750 --> 00:43:13,440 they're astronomers just like me we look 1138 00:43:17,670 --> 00:43:15,760 at the sky day and night all the time i 1139 00:43:18,870 --> 00:43:17,680 haven't seen anything i couldn't explain 1140 00:43:21,109 --> 00:43:18,880 you know we don't have to get to that 1141 00:43:22,150 --> 00:43:21,119 that's kind of old hat by now but well 1142 00:43:23,589 --> 00:43:22,160 it it 1143 00:43:25,750 --> 00:43:23,599 it's also 1144 00:43:27,270 --> 00:43:25,760 the fact that you know there was no 1145 00:43:29,990 --> 00:43:27,280 allocation of 1146 00:43:32,230 --> 00:43:30,000 funds to the search so then all the 1147 00:43:34,390 --> 00:43:32,240 astronomers that say you know we have we 1148 00:43:37,190 --> 00:43:34,400 don't have extraordinary evidence it's 1149 00:43:39,349 --> 00:43:37,200 because the the search was not funded 1150 00:43:41,750 --> 00:43:39,359 and also the best instruments were not 1151 00:43:43,990 --> 00:43:41,760 used in this in that section and that is 1152 00:43:45,750 --> 00:43:44,000 very convenient for for people to say oh 1153 00:43:47,510 --> 00:43:45,760 we don't have extraordinary evidence and 1154 00:43:48,790 --> 00:43:47,520 and therefore we shouldn't find fund it 1155 00:43:50,790 --> 00:43:48,800 because then it's a self-fulfilling 1156 00:43:52,390 --> 00:43:50,800 prophecy you stay ignorant it's just 1157 00:43:54,069 --> 00:43:52,400 like those philosophers that didn't look 1158 00:43:56,870 --> 00:43:54,079 through galileo's telescope you know 1159 00:43:58,550 --> 00:43:56,880 their notion that the sun moves around 1160 00:44:00,710 --> 00:43:58,560 the earth was preserved because they 1161 00:44:03,510 --> 00:44:00,720 didn't look for any evidence that 1162 00:44:05,349 --> 00:44:03,520 doesn't support it and my point is you 1163 00:44:07,589 --> 00:44:05,359 know it's really you need to make an 1164 00:44:09,109 --> 00:44:07,599 effort to learn to learn something new 1165 00:44:11,190 --> 00:44:09,119 you can't just say 1166 00:44:12,870 --> 00:44:11,200 well everything i thought about before 1167 00:44:15,670 --> 00:44:12,880 it must be correct 1168 00:44:19,030 --> 00:44:15,680 and that's it you know unless someone uh 1169 00:44:21,910 --> 00:44:19,040 shows me evidence against it i would not 1170 00:44:24,470 --> 00:44:21,920 even try to get that evidence well 1171 00:44:27,190 --> 00:44:24,480 knowledge requires effort you need to 1172 00:44:30,069 --> 00:44:27,200 look out in order to find something new 1173 00:44:31,349 --> 00:44:30,079 and by ridiculing the search you are 1174 00:44:34,309 --> 00:44:31,359 basically 1175 00:44:36,150 --> 00:44:34,319 uh not not seeking the evidence and 1176 00:44:38,309 --> 00:44:36,160 therefore you know you're maintaining 1177 00:44:40,309 --> 00:44:38,319 your ignorance and that's really 1178 00:44:42,710 --> 00:44:40,319 unfortunate the other thing that i heard 1179 00:44:46,230 --> 00:44:42,720 from some astronomers is i don't have 1180 00:44:48,150 --> 00:44:46,240 time to be be engaged in this search i 1181 00:44:49,190 --> 00:44:48,160 have nothing against it if someone wants 1182 00:44:50,950 --> 00:44:49,200 to do it 1183 00:44:52,950 --> 00:44:50,960 well you know 1184 00:44:55,910 --> 00:44:52,960 this question of whether we are alone or 1185 00:44:58,870 --> 00:44:55,920 not is the most fundamental in science 1186 00:45:00,950 --> 00:44:58,880 and if you don't have time for that 1187 00:45:03,270 --> 00:45:00,960 what do you have time for 1188 00:45:06,230 --> 00:45:03,280 uh trying to find the 1189 00:45:09,190 --> 00:45:06,240 the value of the hubble expansion rate 1190 00:45:11,430 --> 00:45:09,200 to a second decimal point is that really 1191 00:45:15,829 --> 00:45:11,440 much more worthwhile of your 1192 00:45:16,790 --> 00:45:15,839 time you know and i i find that 1193 00:45:19,109 --> 00:45:16,800 just 1194 00:45:21,670 --> 00:45:19,119 inappropriate for 1195 00:45:23,589 --> 00:45:21,680 people to dismiss the search because 1196 00:45:24,630 --> 00:45:23,599 they don't have time because they think 1197 00:45:26,470 --> 00:45:24,640 that 1198 00:45:29,109 --> 00:45:26,480 you need extraordinary evidence before 1199 00:45:31,190 --> 00:45:29,119 you even engage in it and 1200 00:45:33,829 --> 00:45:31,200 the galileo project basically breaks 1201 00:45:36,870 --> 00:45:33,839 that mold you know i got people approach 1202 00:45:39,750 --> 00:45:36,880 me with donations uh without me seeking 1203 00:45:42,550 --> 00:45:39,760 those donations i i got the 100 1204 00:45:45,030 --> 00:45:42,560 volunteers that provide their expertise 1205 00:45:48,069 --> 00:45:45,040 and their time to the project 1206 00:45:51,750 --> 00:45:48,079 without me asking for it and we have a 1207 00:45:52,790 --> 00:45:51,760 huge fan base uh in the general public 1208 00:45:53,829 --> 00:45:52,800 and 1209 00:45:55,829 --> 00:45:53,839 you know 1210 00:45:57,349 --> 00:45:55,839 i think the general public has its heart 1211 00:45:58,390 --> 00:45:57,359 in the right place 1212 00:46:00,309 --> 00:45:58,400 you know 1213 00:46:01,670 --> 00:46:00,319 and and you ask yourself why is it that 1214 00:46:03,270 --> 00:46:01,680 in academia 1215 00:46:05,270 --> 00:46:03,280 the project is not getting as much 1216 00:46:07,510 --> 00:46:05,280 support and i think something is wrong 1217 00:46:09,589 --> 00:46:07,520 with the way that the the mainstream 1218 00:46:11,430 --> 00:46:09,599 addresses it yeah 1219 00:46:13,109 --> 00:46:11,440 especially because the public does 1220 00:46:15,430 --> 00:46:13,119 support it so much 1221 00:46:18,550 --> 00:46:15,440 completely um 1222 00:46:20,309 --> 00:46:18,560 with the james webb telescope um that's 1223 00:46:22,470 --> 00:46:20,319 uh what is that going to be in december 1224 00:46:23,750 --> 00:46:22,480 december 17th or something like that 1225 00:46:25,910 --> 00:46:23,760 it's going to look 1226 00:46:27,349 --> 00:46:25,920 billions of years 1227 00:46:29,190 --> 00:46:27,359 back in time 1228 00:46:31,109 --> 00:46:29,200 um through a tiny little dot as bill 1229 00:46:32,950 --> 00:46:31,119 nelson says it would he which she's one 1230 00:46:34,470 --> 00:46:32,960 of my favorite people by the way 1231 00:46:37,510 --> 00:46:34,480 um 1232 00:46:40,710 --> 00:46:37,520 can you explain to us or if you know i'm 1233 00:46:42,790 --> 00:46:40,720 assuming you do how that works and how 1234 00:46:44,550 --> 00:46:42,800 we would be able to see 1235 00:46:46,710 --> 00:46:44,560 a possible different different 1236 00:46:49,910 --> 00:46:46,720 civilization through that 1237 00:46:51,910 --> 00:46:49,920 yeah so first i i should note that 1238 00:46:54,150 --> 00:46:51,920 the motivation the original motivation 1239 00:46:56,309 --> 00:46:54,160 for the james webb space telescope was 1240 00:46:57,510 --> 00:46:56,319 to find the first stars the first 1241 00:47:01,109 --> 00:46:57,520 galaxies 1242 00:47:04,150 --> 00:47:01,119 the subject that i helped pioneer i have 1243 00:47:05,589 --> 00:47:04,160 actually two textbooks on this subject i 1244 00:47:07,349 --> 00:47:05,599 started working on it when there were 1245 00:47:09,109 --> 00:47:07,359 only a few people around the world that 1246 00:47:11,910 --> 00:47:09,119 even cared about it 1247 00:47:14,710 --> 00:47:11,920 and i took part in the first advisory 1248 00:47:16,550 --> 00:47:14,720 committee to design the james webb space 1249 00:47:20,150 --> 00:47:16,560 telescope back then it was called the 1250 00:47:22,870 --> 00:47:20,160 next generation space telescope and 1251 00:47:25,349 --> 00:47:22,880 so indeed this telescope was designed to 1252 00:47:27,750 --> 00:47:25,359 look at the infrared and and look for 1253 00:47:29,670 --> 00:47:27,760 the first galaxies the first stars in 1254 00:47:32,069 --> 00:47:29,680 the universe that's the scientific 1255 00:47:33,990 --> 00:47:32,079 version of the story of genesis how the 1256 00:47:36,470 --> 00:47:34,000 first light was produced when did the 1257 00:47:38,390 --> 00:47:36,480 first stars form in fact i have a book 1258 00:47:39,910 --> 00:47:38,400 with that title 1259 00:47:41,990 --> 00:47:39,920 and 1260 00:47:44,230 --> 00:47:42,000 that by itself is not related to the 1261 00:47:46,710 --> 00:47:44,240 search for um life 1262 00:47:48,710 --> 00:47:46,720 but now after you know when the 1263 00:47:51,750 --> 00:47:48,720 telescope was conceived we didn't know 1264 00:47:54,950 --> 00:47:51,760 about planets around other stars they 1265 00:47:57,109 --> 00:47:54,960 were not known and now we know that not 1266 00:47:58,950 --> 00:47:57,119 only there are plenty of planets out 1267 00:48:01,750 --> 00:47:58,960 there around other stars but you know 1268 00:48:04,390 --> 00:48:01,760 there are earth-sized planets around 1269 00:48:07,589 --> 00:48:04,400 sun-like stars you know very much 1270 00:48:10,150 --> 00:48:07,599 uh at the same separation and uh what we 1271 00:48:11,829 --> 00:48:10,160 want to know is whether they have life 1272 00:48:13,990 --> 00:48:11,839 on their surface and 1273 00:48:16,470 --> 00:48:14,000 one way to find out is 1274 00:48:17,589 --> 00:48:16,480 if a planet happens to pass in front of 1275 00:48:18,870 --> 00:48:17,599 a star 1276 00:48:22,470 --> 00:48:18,880 uh as it 1277 00:48:24,630 --> 00:48:22,480 orbits around it uh you can look for the 1278 00:48:27,109 --> 00:48:24,640 fingerprints of molecules that are 1279 00:48:30,069 --> 00:48:27,119 indicative for life in the atmosphere of 1280 00:48:32,549 --> 00:48:30,079 the planet uh and the the james webb 1281 00:48:36,150 --> 00:48:32,559 space telescope can take the first 1282 00:48:38,150 --> 00:48:36,160 steps in that direction uh but to me i 1283 00:48:39,750 --> 00:48:38,160 mean most of the astronomy community is 1284 00:48:44,069 --> 00:48:39,760 interested in finding evidence for 1285 00:48:46,309 --> 00:48:44,079 oxygen or methane these are 1286 00:48:47,349 --> 00:48:46,319 molecules that are indicative of life on 1287 00:48:49,750 --> 00:48:47,359 earth but 1288 00:48:52,710 --> 00:48:49,760 but we should keep in mind that these 1289 00:48:55,030 --> 00:48:52,720 molecules for example oxygen was not 1290 00:48:57,589 --> 00:48:55,040 very abundant in the earth atmosphere in 1291 00:48:58,950 --> 00:48:57,599 the first two billion years so for half 1292 00:49:01,349 --> 00:48:58,960 of the age 1293 00:49:02,790 --> 00:49:01,359 of the earth 1294 00:49:05,109 --> 00:49:02,800 there was not much oxygen in the 1295 00:49:07,270 --> 00:49:05,119 atmosphere so if you don't find oxygen 1296 00:49:09,270 --> 00:49:07,280 in the atmosphere of another planet it 1297 00:49:11,030 --> 00:49:09,280 doesn't mean that there is no there are 1298 00:49:13,109 --> 00:49:11,040 no microbes on it 1299 00:49:15,510 --> 00:49:13,119 because earth is an example where there 1300 00:49:17,109 --> 00:49:15,520 wasn't oxygen and there were microbes 1301 00:49:19,829 --> 00:49:17,119 for two billion years 1302 00:49:21,349 --> 00:49:19,839 and then if you do find oxygen it also 1303 00:49:23,910 --> 00:49:21,359 doesn't tell you that there is life 1304 00:49:26,630 --> 00:49:23,920 necessarily because you can make oxygen 1305 00:49:27,990 --> 00:49:26,640 in in natural ways without 1306 00:49:29,670 --> 00:49:28,000 and 1307 00:49:31,190 --> 00:49:29,680 there is one way by which you can 1308 00:49:33,750 --> 00:49:31,200 actually tell that there is life 1309 00:49:36,069 --> 00:49:33,760 unambiguously and that's if you find 1310 00:49:38,950 --> 00:49:36,079 industrial pollution in the atmosphere 1311 00:49:40,790 --> 00:49:38,960 of a planet right or cfc molecules you 1312 00:49:42,950 --> 00:49:40,800 know that are produced by refrigerating 1313 00:49:44,549 --> 00:49:42,960 systems and industries here on earth 1314 00:49:47,270 --> 00:49:44,559 these are the molecules that destroy the 1315 00:49:48,390 --> 00:49:47,280 ozone in our atmosphere so just imagine 1316 00:49:50,069 --> 00:49:48,400 another 1317 00:49:53,030 --> 00:49:50,079 planet and 1318 00:49:57,430 --> 00:49:55,430 those fingerprints those molecules it 1319 00:49:59,349 --> 00:49:57,440 will indicate that not only there is 1320 00:50:01,670 --> 00:49:59,359 life there but there there is industrial 1321 00:50:03,829 --> 00:50:01,680 life there there is technological life 1322 00:50:06,710 --> 00:50:03,839 and that would be unambiguous and i 1323 00:50:09,670 --> 00:50:06,720 wrote a paper about it then in 2015 1324 00:50:11,670 --> 00:50:09,680 suggesting that once again and all these 1325 00:50:13,670 --> 00:50:11,680 big telescopes of the future are being 1326 00:50:15,670 --> 00:50:13,680 motivated by looking for oxygen not by 1327 00:50:16,549 --> 00:50:15,680 looking for industrial pollution and i 1328 00:50:17,589 --> 00:50:16,559 think 1329 00:50:19,349 --> 00:50:17,599 it should be 1330 00:50:21,109 --> 00:50:19,359 a motivation 1331 00:50:22,790 --> 00:50:21,119 now let me ask you what have you not 1332 00:50:23,280 --> 00:50:22,800 written a paper or book about at this 1333 00:50:25,510 --> 00:50:23,290 point 1334 00:50:27,750 --> 00:50:25,520 [Laughter] 1335 00:50:30,950 --> 00:50:27,760 well if there is something then i will 1336 00:50:35,750 --> 00:50:33,430 what would be the next book for you 1337 00:50:37,510 --> 00:50:35,760 yes so i'm actually working on it now 1338 00:50:39,030 --> 00:50:37,520 and 1339 00:50:42,470 --> 00:50:39,040 um 1340 00:50:44,309 --> 00:50:42,480 i i'm not allowed to reveal the content 1341 00:50:47,670 --> 00:50:44,319 because 1342 00:50:49,990 --> 00:50:47,680 i i i need to to write it up and my 1343 00:50:51,030 --> 00:50:50,000 publisher asked me not to tell what it's 1344 00:50:56,549 --> 00:50:51,040 all about 1345 00:51:00,390 --> 00:50:59,190 you know my my previous book was 1346 00:51:03,589 --> 00:51:00,400 selected 1347 00:51:06,790 --> 00:51:03,599 yesterday to be as a bestseller in 1348 00:51:07,750 --> 00:51:06,800 non-fiction and in science on amazon 1349 00:51:09,910 --> 00:51:07,760 and 1350 00:51:12,549 --> 00:51:09,920 that was a surprise i didn't best seller 1351 00:51:13,829 --> 00:51:12,559 of the year um one of the best 1352 00:51:16,309 --> 00:51:13,839 and um 1353 00:51:19,270 --> 00:51:16,319 you know all i can say is that i will 1354 00:51:21,750 --> 00:51:19,280 try to make the next one even better 1355 00:51:24,470 --> 00:51:21,760 and and what i also what i 1356 00:51:26,870 --> 00:51:24,480 have now is aside from the writing i'm 1357 00:51:29,589 --> 00:51:26,880 i'm engaged in the galileo project and i 1358 00:51:32,950 --> 00:51:29,599 really want to promote this project 1359 00:51:34,870 --> 00:51:32,960 to a level that everyone um 1360 00:51:38,309 --> 00:51:34,880 supporting the project right now will be 1361 00:51:40,150 --> 00:51:38,319 proud of the uh results and then you 1362 00:51:42,710 --> 00:51:40,160 know it's really an obligation after 1363 00:51:44,870 --> 00:51:42,720 seeing the people that support it i feel 1364 00:51:45,829 --> 00:51:44,880 uh obligated you know it's really my 1365 00:51:48,870 --> 00:51:45,839 duty 1366 00:51:51,270 --> 00:51:48,880 to bring it to fruition and provide 1367 00:51:54,309 --> 00:51:51,280 new to shed new light 1368 00:51:58,150 --> 00:51:54,319 on the nature of unidentified aerial 1369 00:51:59,190 --> 00:51:58,160 phenomena the nature of objects like 1370 00:52:01,589 --> 00:51:59,200 and 1371 00:52:03,190 --> 00:52:01,599 if we in the coming years 1372 00:52:05,030 --> 00:52:03,200 get the data 1373 00:52:06,630 --> 00:52:05,040 that allows us to understand these 1374 00:52:07,750 --> 00:52:06,640 objects better 1375 00:52:10,309 --> 00:52:07,760 you know that would be a major 1376 00:52:11,349 --> 00:52:10,319 contribution and we we cleared up the 1377 00:52:13,750 --> 00:52:11,359 fog 1378 00:52:16,630 --> 00:52:13,760 and we will do it in a scientific way 1379 00:52:18,710 --> 00:52:16,640 and it will be transparent open 1380 00:52:20,790 --> 00:52:18,720 you know just the way i speak you know i 1381 00:52:23,349 --> 00:52:20,800 never manipulate people i always you 1382 00:52:24,390 --> 00:52:23,359 what what you see is what you get 1383 00:52:27,349 --> 00:52:24,400 um 1384 00:52:29,190 --> 00:52:27,359 you know you're guided in your strength 1385 00:52:32,870 --> 00:52:29,200 and your resolve comes from when you 1386 00:52:34,950 --> 00:52:32,880 were a kid and being you know told that 1387 00:52:37,270 --> 00:52:34,960 uh that they didn't have it the answer 1388 00:52:38,150 --> 00:52:37,280 for you or you couldn't know the answer 1389 00:52:40,069 --> 00:52:38,160 and 1390 00:52:42,470 --> 00:52:40,079 you know are you still finding that in 1391 00:52:44,950 --> 00:52:42,480 your life today other than the galileo 1392 00:52:47,510 --> 00:52:44,960 project and if so how do you treat that 1393 00:52:49,750 --> 00:52:47,520 now right so when i was a kid the most 1394 00:52:52,309 --> 00:52:49,760 vivid memory was to attend dinners where 1395 00:52:55,430 --> 00:52:52,319 the adults in the room so to speak 1396 00:52:57,589 --> 00:52:55,440 um would behave in way in a way that it 1397 00:52:59,589 --> 00:52:57,599 was very frustrating to me i would ask a 1398 00:53:01,430 --> 00:52:59,599 question and they would 1399 00:53:03,109 --> 00:53:01,440 suggest an answer that didn't make much 1400 00:53:05,109 --> 00:53:03,119 sense they would pretend they know more 1401 00:53:07,829 --> 00:53:05,119 than they actually know that was the 1402 00:53:09,750 --> 00:53:07,839 good experience the bad experience was 1403 00:53:11,510 --> 00:53:09,760 when they would dismiss my question 1404 00:53:13,670 --> 00:53:11,520 because they didn't know the answer they 1405 00:53:15,750 --> 00:53:13,680 would say it's unimportant and move on 1406 00:53:18,150 --> 00:53:15,760 and i felt really frustrated and you 1407 00:53:20,150 --> 00:53:18,160 know that was a repeating a recurring 1408 00:53:22,549 --> 00:53:20,160 experience and i thought that by 1409 00:53:25,109 --> 00:53:22,559 becoming a scientist i will be able to 1410 00:53:28,230 --> 00:53:25,119 maintain my childhood curiosity 1411 00:53:31,349 --> 00:53:28,240 ask questions and i will be surrounded 1412 00:53:33,190 --> 00:53:31,359 by like-minded people that will will be 1413 00:53:37,190 --> 00:53:33,200 motivated by finding answers to 1414 00:53:39,750 --> 00:53:37,200 questions and nothing else um but 1415 00:53:42,230 --> 00:53:39,760 i was wrong uh you know even within the 1416 00:53:44,470 --> 00:53:42,240 scientific community where people that 1417 00:53:46,790 --> 00:53:44,480 get tenure which you know by the way the 1418 00:53:48,630 --> 00:53:46,800 the purpose of tenure is to give you job 1419 00:53:50,950 --> 00:53:48,640 security so that you can 1420 00:53:52,390 --> 00:53:50,960 you can stop pretending you know more 1421 00:53:54,309 --> 00:53:52,400 than you actually know and you can 1422 00:53:56,790 --> 00:53:54,319 pursue questions that are of great 1423 00:53:58,950 --> 00:53:56,800 importance take some risks you know 1424 00:54:01,190 --> 00:53:58,960 and innovate that's the whole purpose of 1425 00:54:03,510 --> 00:54:01,200 that but instead when people get tenure 1426 00:54:06,069 --> 00:54:03,520 they worry about their image they want 1427 00:54:07,750 --> 00:54:06,079 to be regarded as experts and they 1428 00:54:09,829 --> 00:54:07,760 pretend that they know much more than 1429 00:54:11,430 --> 00:54:09,839 they actually know and they shy away 1430 00:54:13,990 --> 00:54:11,440 from questions that may 1431 00:54:15,990 --> 00:54:14,000 involve some risk so if there is a 1432 00:54:18,549 --> 00:54:16,000 possibility that a muammar is an 1433 00:54:20,150 --> 00:54:18,559 artificial object they will shy run away 1434 00:54:21,990 --> 00:54:20,160 from that because there is a risk 1435 00:54:24,549 --> 00:54:22,000 involved if it turns out to be a 1436 00:54:26,630 --> 00:54:24,559 nitrogen iceberg or a hydrogen iceberg 1437 00:54:29,190 --> 00:54:26,640 you went in the wrong direction but i 1438 00:54:31,109 --> 00:54:29,200 say we learn something new if it's a 1439 00:54:33,030 --> 00:54:31,119 nitrogen iceberg we've never seen it 1440 00:54:34,950 --> 00:54:33,040 something like it before then we know 1441 00:54:37,670 --> 00:54:34,960 there are nurseries of these objects 1442 00:54:39,270 --> 00:54:37,680 that are very common in the universe and 1443 00:54:41,430 --> 00:54:39,280 we've learned something new so what's 1444 00:54:43,829 --> 00:54:41,440 bad about it let's just collect as much 1445 00:54:46,069 --> 00:54:43,839 evidence as possible and 1446 00:54:49,030 --> 00:54:46,079 you know albert einstein the most 1447 00:54:51,510 --> 00:54:49,040 admired physicist of the 20th century 1448 00:54:53,670 --> 00:54:51,520 uh made three major mistakes in the last 1449 00:54:55,910 --> 00:54:53,680 decade of his career he argued that 1450 00:54:58,789 --> 00:54:55,920 black holes do not exist gravitational 1451 00:55:00,309 --> 00:54:58,799 waves do not exist and quantum mechanics 1452 00:55:02,630 --> 00:55:00,319 doesn't have spooky action at the 1453 00:55:03,670 --> 00:55:02,640 distance now you ask yourself how is it 1454 00:55:05,510 --> 00:55:03,680 possible 1455 00:55:07,670 --> 00:55:05,520 that he made those mistakes that's 1456 00:55:08,870 --> 00:55:07,680 because he worked at the frontiers and 1457 00:55:10,069 --> 00:55:08,880 very often when you work at the 1458 00:55:12,549 --> 00:55:10,079 frontiers 1459 00:55:15,030 --> 00:55:12,559 you don't know the correct path and you 1460 00:55:17,990 --> 00:55:15,040 are guided by the wrong ideas 1461 00:55:19,670 --> 00:55:18,000 but that's the nature of discovery and 1462 00:55:21,990 --> 00:55:19,680 we should think about science as a 1463 00:55:24,789 --> 00:55:22,000 learning experience so why should it be 1464 00:55:26,870 --> 00:55:24,799 ridiculed to consider 1465 00:55:29,270 --> 00:55:26,880 the possibility of artificial objects in 1466 00:55:33,190 --> 00:55:29,280 space to look for them why should that 1467 00:55:35,510 --> 00:55:33,200 be ignored ridiculed and dismissed 1468 00:55:37,109 --> 00:55:35,520 when much more speculative ideas are 1469 00:55:38,789 --> 00:55:37,119 being pursued this part of the 1470 00:55:40,710 --> 00:55:38,799 mainstream and the only way i can 1471 00:55:43,030 --> 00:55:40,720 understand it is because people are 1472 00:55:45,510 --> 00:55:43,040 guided by their ego they are not guided 1473 00:55:46,470 --> 00:55:45,520 by the desire to figure out what reality 1474 00:55:48,630 --> 00:55:46,480 is like 1475 00:55:50,230 --> 00:55:48,640 yeah it you know it's kind of 1476 00:55:52,230 --> 00:55:50,240 interesting because 1477 00:55:54,710 --> 00:55:52,240 i think on the one hand there may be 1478 00:55:56,630 --> 00:55:54,720 some fear involved of 1479 00:55:58,630 --> 00:55:56,640 um you know like you said going after 1480 00:56:02,069 --> 00:55:58,640 something and failing but on the other 1481 00:56:04,870 --> 00:56:02,079 hand um a lot of the attitude also comes 1482 00:56:07,670 --> 00:56:04,880 from jealousy that the other person is 1483 00:56:09,270 --> 00:56:07,680 doing it and they may find something 1484 00:56:11,270 --> 00:56:09,280 and they won't be the ones so it's kind 1485 00:56:13,670 --> 00:56:11,280 of like a double-sided thing there i 1486 00:56:15,589 --> 00:56:13,680 agree uh but if you look back at history 1487 00:56:18,230 --> 00:56:15,599 for example there were people claiming 1488 00:56:20,309 --> 00:56:18,240 the human body has a soul 1489 00:56:22,630 --> 00:56:20,319 and they were afraid of dissecting the 1490 00:56:25,670 --> 00:56:22,640 human body so that you wouldn't hurt the 1491 00:56:28,309 --> 00:56:25,680 soul and so people were arguing against 1492 00:56:29,910 --> 00:56:28,319 anatomy now suppose scientists were 1493 00:56:31,829 --> 00:56:29,920 behaving the same way they behave in 1494 00:56:33,589 --> 00:56:31,839 this context and they would say you know 1495 00:56:35,349 --> 00:56:33,599 it's a controversial subject there are 1496 00:56:38,150 --> 00:56:35,359 some people claiming things that do not 1497 00:56:39,829 --> 00:56:38,160 make sense but we don't want to touch it 1498 00:56:42,230 --> 00:56:39,839 we don't want to take any risk about the 1499 00:56:44,309 --> 00:56:42,240 human body we don't want to operate the 1500 00:56:46,630 --> 00:56:44,319 human body because some people are 1501 00:56:49,430 --> 00:56:46,640 making nonsensical statements about the 1502 00:56:51,990 --> 00:56:49,440 human body having a soul or something 1503 00:56:53,750 --> 00:56:52,000 then where would modern medicine be 1504 00:56:55,990 --> 00:56:53,760 we wouldn't have the understanding that 1505 00:56:57,910 --> 00:56:56,000 we have of the human body so as a 1506 00:56:58,870 --> 00:56:57,920 scientist you have to be courageous to 1507 00:57:01,750 --> 00:56:58,880 say 1508 00:57:05,190 --> 00:57:01,760 i have the ability using my instruments 1509 00:57:07,829 --> 00:57:05,200 to figure out what is inside let's 1510 00:57:10,789 --> 00:57:07,839 courageously examine a subject 1511 00:57:13,510 --> 00:57:10,799 that is controversial that is risky we 1512 00:57:16,470 --> 00:57:13,520 don't know what it what lies behind it 1513 00:57:19,510 --> 00:57:16,480 but you know by getting better evidence 1514 00:57:22,230 --> 00:57:19,520 better data we can clear up the fog so 1515 00:57:24,069 --> 00:57:22,240 when people started 1516 00:57:26,549 --> 00:57:24,079 doing anatomy they learn about the human 1517 00:57:30,309 --> 00:57:26,559 body and they realize that you can help 1518 00:57:31,750 --> 00:57:30,319 people survive diseases or illnesses and 1519 00:57:34,069 --> 00:57:31,760 you can actually 1520 00:57:36,230 --> 00:57:34,079 repair the human body and that was 1521 00:57:39,030 --> 00:57:36,240 extremely helpful so once again this is 1522 00:57:40,870 --> 00:57:39,040 another example where knowing reality is 1523 00:57:44,309 --> 00:57:40,880 always beneficial because then you know 1524 00:57:46,309 --> 00:57:44,319 how to use it for your benefit yeah as a 1525 00:57:48,630 --> 00:57:46,319 musician i think of an electric guitar 1526 00:57:51,270 --> 00:57:48,640 one but when um 1527 00:57:54,470 --> 00:57:51,280 that was first being uh made 1528 00:57:57,190 --> 00:57:54,480 um it was thought of as a joke 1529 00:57:58,870 --> 00:57:57,200 and we see where where that's gotten us 1530 00:58:01,270 --> 00:57:58,880 now you know now people play 1531 00:58:04,950 --> 00:58:01,280 synthesizers in computer music but hey 1532 00:58:06,390 --> 00:58:04,960 for a while electric guitar was the 1533 00:58:08,789 --> 00:58:06,400 i should tell you that 1534 00:58:10,230 --> 00:58:08,799 this morning you know every day is a new 1535 00:58:12,230 --> 00:58:10,240 day for me because there are lots of 1536 00:58:14,069 --> 00:58:12,240 things happening that are quite exciting 1537 00:58:16,549 --> 00:58:14,079 and i would never anticipate them in 1538 00:58:19,430 --> 00:58:16,559 advance so this morning i was asked to 1539 00:58:20,230 --> 00:58:19,440 take part in a class at harvard 1540 00:58:22,630 --> 00:58:20,240 and 1541 00:58:25,270 --> 00:58:22,640 one of the questions that was asked by a 1542 00:58:27,349 --> 00:58:25,280 student was there is the golden record 1543 00:58:30,309 --> 00:58:27,359 that you know we sent out 1544 00:58:32,630 --> 00:58:30,319 with the voyager and they asked me 1545 00:58:35,109 --> 00:58:32,640 and that student asked me 1546 00:58:37,670 --> 00:58:35,119 what kind of music would you put on it 1547 00:58:39,030 --> 00:58:37,680 well first of all i said 1548 00:58:41,430 --> 00:58:39,040 that um 1549 00:58:43,910 --> 00:58:41,440 i find this golden record embarrassing 1550 00:58:46,390 --> 00:58:43,920 because people were very proud of the 1551 00:58:48,950 --> 00:58:46,400 culture of the 60s for example and you 1552 00:58:50,390 --> 00:58:48,960 know by today's standards it's very 1553 00:58:52,950 --> 00:58:50,400 uh 1554 00:58:55,589 --> 00:58:52,960 embarrassing in a way because i i think 1555 00:58:56,630 --> 00:58:55,599 we should send a rocket that moves much 1556 00:58:59,190 --> 00:58:56,640 faster 1557 00:59:01,270 --> 00:58:59,200 than voyager so that if an 1558 00:59:02,470 --> 00:59:01,280 extraterrestrial finds something it 1559 00:59:04,470 --> 00:59:02,480 would find 1560 00:59:06,549 --> 00:59:04,480 our most advanced technologies first you 1561 00:59:08,150 --> 00:59:06,559 know otherwise it would be i mean they 1562 00:59:09,910 --> 00:59:08,160 would look at our culture and say oh 1563 00:59:11,190 --> 00:59:09,920 that's ridiculous you know that's 1564 00:59:13,589 --> 00:59:11,200 yeah and 1565 00:59:15,349 --> 00:59:13,599 i said but in general in answer to the 1566 00:59:17,510 --> 00:59:15,359 question of the student i would put them 1567 00:59:19,430 --> 00:59:17,520 the latest music the most advanced the 1568 00:59:21,589 --> 00:59:19,440 cutting edge music because i'm always 1569 00:59:24,630 --> 00:59:21,599 about the cutting edge gadgets the 1570 00:59:27,349 --> 00:59:24,640 cutting edge music anything that we do i 1571 00:59:29,910 --> 00:59:27,359 think we're getting better over time and 1572 00:59:32,069 --> 00:59:29,920 i don't want us to to waste our 1573 00:59:33,030 --> 00:59:32,079 reputation on things from the past you 1574 00:59:35,910 --> 00:59:33,040 know 1575 00:59:38,230 --> 00:59:35,920 i want them to see our 1576 00:59:40,150 --> 00:59:38,240 best accomplishments the other thing i 1577 00:59:42,069 --> 00:59:40,160 should say about an embarrassing thing 1578 00:59:45,030 --> 00:59:42,079 we sent to space you know about the new 1579 00:59:47,030 --> 00:59:45,040 horizons mission that went to study 1580 00:59:50,549 --> 00:59:47,040 pluto and 1581 00:59:54,549 --> 00:59:50,559 nasa decided to put on that spacecraft 1582 00:59:57,270 --> 00:59:54,559 30 grams of the ashes of clyde tambou oh 1583 01:00:00,150 --> 00:59:57,280 we talked about it discovered the 1584 01:00:02,309 --> 01:00:00,160 discovered the pluto in commemoration of 1585 01:00:05,349 --> 01:00:02,319 his contribution and 1586 01:00:08,230 --> 01:00:05,359 i just found that ridiculous because 1587 01:00:09,349 --> 01:00:08,240 the ashes are just dna that was burned 1588 01:00:11,349 --> 01:00:09,359 up 1589 01:00:14,230 --> 01:00:11,359 from his body so it carries no 1590 01:00:16,630 --> 01:00:14,240 information whatsoever so it's just like 1591 01:00:19,030 --> 01:00:16,640 the ashes of a cigarette that you put on 1592 01:00:21,270 --> 01:00:19,040 on the spacecraft and and it's really 1593 01:00:23,190 --> 01:00:21,280 embarrassing to send it out because if 1594 01:00:25,349 --> 01:00:23,200 an extraterrestrial finds it 1595 01:00:27,349 --> 01:00:25,359 you know it the extraterrestrial would 1596 01:00:29,030 --> 01:00:27,359 realize that we have this 1597 01:00:30,630 --> 01:00:29,040 very primitive 1598 01:00:32,069 --> 01:00:30,640 routine of 1599 01:00:34,230 --> 01:00:32,079 destroying the information about the 1600 01:00:36,230 --> 01:00:34,240 person that we want to commemorate that 1601 01:00:40,230 --> 01:00:36,240 makes no sense whatsoever why did they 1602 01:00:45,270 --> 01:00:42,549 we can do better 1603 01:00:47,990 --> 01:00:45,280 we keep sending out things that 1604 01:00:49,589 --> 01:00:48,000 tell the outside world that 1605 01:00:51,990 --> 01:00:49,599 we are not that advanced you know we're 1606 01:00:54,230 --> 01:00:52,000 not the smartest kid on the blog and it 1607 01:00:56,230 --> 01:00:54,240 basically shows that we are not but you 1608 01:00:58,309 --> 01:00:56,240 know they're not going to know what kind 1609 01:01:00,230 --> 01:00:58,319 of technology we'll have in the next 20 1610 01:01:02,549 --> 01:01:00,240 30 40 years you could say that now about 1611 01:01:04,870 --> 01:01:02,559 what we'll have in a hundred years right 1612 01:01:07,270 --> 01:01:04,880 yeah i mean hopefully we will send out 1613 01:01:09,829 --> 01:01:07,280 the equipment that moves faster so it 1614 01:01:12,230 --> 01:01:09,839 will overtake that those primitive 1615 01:01:13,430 --> 01:01:12,240 things we sent before but overall i 1616 01:01:16,309 --> 01:01:13,440 should say that 1617 01:01:18,069 --> 01:01:16,319 you know the when i go to university 1618 01:01:20,150 --> 01:01:18,079 hall you know at harvard that's the 1619 01:01:23,510 --> 01:01:20,160 place where you can find all the 1620 01:01:24,950 --> 01:01:23,520 paintings and statues of 1621 01:01:27,589 --> 01:01:24,960 sculptures of 1622 01:01:29,910 --> 01:01:27,599 past deans and and presidents that 1623 01:01:32,309 --> 01:01:29,920 wanted to preserve something 1624 01:01:34,470 --> 01:01:32,319 the way they looked physically by making 1625 01:01:35,430 --> 01:01:34,480 a painting for example 1626 01:01:37,510 --> 01:01:35,440 that 1627 01:01:39,910 --> 01:01:37,520 doesn't make a lot of sense because you 1628 01:01:44,789 --> 01:01:42,390 they would survive at most a billion 1629 01:01:46,950 --> 01:01:44,799 years because once the sun 1630 01:01:49,750 --> 01:01:46,960 expands in a billion years will get 1631 01:01:51,349 --> 01:01:49,760 hotter and will burn up everything on 1632 01:01:53,990 --> 01:01:51,359 the surface of the earth you know all 1633 01:01:56,309 --> 01:01:54,000 the oceans will be boiled off 1634 01:01:58,230 --> 01:01:56,319 so these uh 1635 01:02:00,630 --> 01:01:58,240 memories would be lost 1636 01:02:03,190 --> 01:02:00,640 uh if you want to preserve something of 1637 01:02:05,589 --> 01:02:03,200 yourself you better send it to space in 1638 01:02:08,549 --> 01:02:05,599 the form for example of ai systems that 1639 01:02:11,109 --> 01:02:08,559 carry your consciousness in some way 1640 01:02:14,470 --> 01:02:11,119 because that could survive for billions 1641 01:02:16,870 --> 01:02:14,480 of years that can outlast the sun and so 1642 01:02:19,910 --> 01:02:16,880 these are what i call interstellar 1643 01:02:23,430 --> 01:02:19,920 monuments these are things that would 1644 01:02:25,829 --> 01:02:23,440 survive the longest and that's the most 1645 01:02:26,710 --> 01:02:25,839 reasonable thing to 1646 01:02:30,069 --> 01:02:26,720 make 1647 01:02:31,750 --> 01:02:30,079 that would stay for a while you know and 1648 01:02:34,470 --> 01:02:31,760 the other thing as i mentioned in 1649 01:02:36,549 --> 01:02:34,480 washington you know lifting your body by 1650 01:02:37,430 --> 01:02:36,559 one percent of the earth radius which is 1651 01:02:40,069 --> 01:02:37,440 what 1652 01:02:41,190 --> 01:02:40,079 uh was done by some wealthy individuals 1653 01:02:44,710 --> 01:02:41,200 recently 1654 01:02:47,430 --> 01:02:44,720 uh you know flying to working quad space 1655 01:02:49,270 --> 01:02:47,440 that's also not very impressive because 1656 01:02:51,589 --> 01:02:49,280 the size of the observable universe is 1657 01:02:53,270 --> 01:02:51,599 10 to the power 19 times bigger than the 1658 01:02:55,029 --> 01:02:53,280 radius of the earth so 1659 01:02:57,430 --> 01:02:55,039 you know showing off in space is an 1660 01:02:58,470 --> 01:02:57,440 oxymoron and 1661 01:03:00,549 --> 01:02:58,480 therefore 1662 01:03:02,309 --> 01:03:00,559 you know we should be modest that's the 1663 01:03:04,309 --> 01:03:02,319 most important thing we should realize 1664 01:03:06,230 --> 01:03:04,319 that you know we are not that important 1665 01:03:08,950 --> 01:03:06,240 in the big scheme of things 1666 01:03:11,029 --> 01:03:08,960 and moreover that we should learn from 1667 01:03:12,789 --> 01:03:11,039 looking at the sky rather than assume 1668 01:03:14,630 --> 01:03:12,799 that we know everything in advance and 1669 01:03:17,349 --> 01:03:14,640 think that we are the smartest which we 1670 01:03:18,789 --> 01:03:17,359 very often do yeah 1671 01:03:20,470 --> 01:03:18,799 you know 1672 01:03:21,829 --> 01:03:20,480 i don't know how much time you have here 1673 01:03:22,870 --> 01:03:21,839 but um 1674 01:03:25,109 --> 01:03:22,880 what do you what do you think of 1675 01:03:27,029 --> 01:03:25,119 gillibrand's um 1676 01:03:29,190 --> 01:03:27,039 words recently where 1677 01:03:31,510 --> 01:03:29,200 you know she puts other things on the 1678 01:03:34,789 --> 01:03:31,520 table other entities 1679 01:03:37,109 --> 01:03:34,799 um the unknown perhaps as far as these 1680 01:03:40,069 --> 01:03:37,119 uaps interacting with the with the navy 1681 01:03:43,029 --> 01:03:40,079 and everything right um now that's 1682 01:03:45,029 --> 01:03:43,039 that's a change as as far as public to 1683 01:03:47,349 --> 01:03:45,039 the public goes well 1684 01:03:49,349 --> 01:03:47,359 so it's a it's a significant change if 1685 01:03:51,670 --> 01:03:49,359 it represents 1686 01:03:52,390 --> 01:03:51,680 knowledge okay you see 1687 01:03:54,870 --> 01:03:52,400 so 1688 01:03:57,430 --> 01:03:54,880 the public is exposed to the tip of the 1689 01:03:59,270 --> 01:03:57,440 iceberg of the data that the government 1690 01:04:00,870 --> 01:03:59,280 owns and in fact even within the 1691 01:04:02,870 --> 01:04:00,880 government there are different sections 1692 01:04:04,870 --> 01:04:02,880 and they probably don't know 1693 01:04:07,109 --> 01:04:04,880 the data that exists in some other 1694 01:04:08,789 --> 01:04:07,119 sections and the point the idea of 1695 01:04:11,029 --> 01:04:08,799 establishing an or 1696 01:04:12,549 --> 01:04:11,039 an entity that will study all this data 1697 01:04:15,109 --> 01:04:12,559 i think makes a lot of sense i'm a 1698 01:04:17,029 --> 01:04:15,119 strong supporter of this amendment 1699 01:04:21,990 --> 01:04:17,039 and 1700 01:04:22,789 --> 01:04:22,000 some transparency to what we 1701 01:04:24,630 --> 01:04:22,799 know 1702 01:04:27,990 --> 01:04:24,640 but in parallel to that it's really 1703 01:04:31,190 --> 01:04:28,000 important to have a team of scientists 1704 01:04:33,190 --> 01:04:31,200 trying to collect new data using better 1705 01:04:34,789 --> 01:04:33,200 equipment that was used in the past 1706 01:04:37,829 --> 01:04:34,799 that's what the galileo project is all 1707 01:04:40,470 --> 01:04:37,839 about and the guerrilla projects is 1708 01:04:43,190 --> 01:04:40,480 mentioned in the amendment when you know 1709 01:04:45,430 --> 01:04:43,200 um and we very much support the 1710 01:04:48,230 --> 01:04:45,440 amendment and and will try to help as 1711 01:04:50,870 --> 01:04:48,240 much as possible identify the nature of 1712 01:04:53,430 --> 01:04:50,880 these unidentified aerial phenomena who 1713 01:04:55,029 --> 01:04:53,440 are you going to pick to be here 1714 01:04:57,029 --> 01:04:55,039 who would you pick 1715 01:04:59,910 --> 01:04:57,039 well that's a very good question and the 1716 01:05:04,069 --> 01:05:01,029 well 1717 01:05:06,069 --> 01:05:04,079 yeah i'm getting 1718 01:05:07,670 --> 01:05:06,079 emails from people that are interested 1719 01:05:10,870 --> 01:05:07,680 but sure 1720 01:05:13,349 --> 01:05:10,880 i i i you know there is no rush i i can 1721 01:05:14,390 --> 01:05:13,359 take my time and make uh the selection 1722 01:05:16,710 --> 01:05:14,400 first of all 1723 01:05:18,789 --> 01:05:16,720 we need to wait to see that it passes 1724 01:05:20,470 --> 01:05:18,799 that it's approved by the senate and 1725 01:05:21,670 --> 01:05:20,480 yeah i very much hope that would be the 1726 01:05:23,829 --> 01:05:21,680 case 1727 01:05:24,789 --> 01:05:23,839 and then of course um 1728 01:05:27,109 --> 01:05:24,799 you know 1729 01:05:30,309 --> 01:05:27,119 more important than who serves on the 1730 01:05:32,309 --> 01:05:30,319 advisory board and in the organization 1731 01:05:33,750 --> 01:05:32,319 is what do they find you know that 1732 01:05:36,069 --> 01:05:33,760 that's the most important thing because 1733 01:05:37,910 --> 01:05:36,079 as i said before it's not about us it's 1734 01:05:40,150 --> 01:05:37,920 about trying to figure out reality 1735 01:05:41,430 --> 01:05:40,160 trying to figure out what's out there 1736 01:05:42,309 --> 01:05:41,440 and then 1737 01:05:45,349 --> 01:05:42,319 and 1738 01:05:47,589 --> 01:05:45,359 let's just do a honest job you know if 1739 01:05:49,430 --> 01:05:47,599 getting more data not ridiculing the 1740 01:05:51,190 --> 01:05:49,440 subject i think the 1741 01:05:53,990 --> 01:05:51,200 an important aspect of all of these 1742 01:05:56,150 --> 01:05:54,000 developments is that um you know people 1743 01:05:57,270 --> 01:05:56,160 are taking it more seriously and 1744 01:05:59,910 --> 01:05:57,280 uh 1745 01:06:01,109 --> 01:05:59,920 that was my goal from day one 1746 01:06:02,950 --> 01:06:01,119 uh 1747 01:06:04,710 --> 01:06:02,960 i thought that it's worth taking 1748 01:06:06,309 --> 01:06:04,720 seriously you know and suppose the 1749 01:06:09,190 --> 01:06:06,319 guerrilla project 1750 01:06:11,750 --> 01:06:09,200 searches and you know 1751 01:06:13,670 --> 01:06:11,760 figures out that these uap are some 1752 01:06:17,109 --> 01:06:13,680 natural phenomena 1753 01:06:19,670 --> 01:06:17,119 so be it you know then at least we'll 1754 01:06:22,549 --> 01:06:19,680 put to rest all these speculations that 1755 01:06:24,630 --> 01:06:22,559 people have suppose we find that omua 1756 01:06:26,630 --> 01:06:24,640 was a nitrogen iceberg 1757 01:06:28,789 --> 01:06:26,640 so be it you know i don't 1758 01:06:31,190 --> 01:06:28,799 i wouldn't feel hurt i would just feel 1759 01:06:33,029 --> 01:06:31,200 that we learn something new and so 1760 01:06:35,670 --> 01:06:33,039 we are guide we will be guided by 1761 01:06:38,789 --> 01:06:35,680 evidence and the the thing that we want 1762 01:06:40,230 --> 01:06:38,799 to avoid by collecting the evidence is 1763 01:06:41,829 --> 01:06:40,240 ignorance 1764 01:06:43,670 --> 01:06:41,839 if you don't collect the evidence you 1765 01:06:46,470 --> 01:06:43,680 think you know the answer in advance 1766 01:06:49,510 --> 01:06:46,480 just like my colleague uh after hearing 1767 01:06:51,829 --> 01:06:49,520 about omar said it's so weird i wish it 1768 01:06:53,589 --> 01:06:51,839 never existed because for him it's just 1769 01:06:55,750 --> 01:06:53,599 like a fly 1770 01:06:57,829 --> 01:06:55,760 you know standing on your own 1771 01:07:00,390 --> 01:06:57,839 on your arm you want to 1772 01:07:03,750 --> 01:07:00,400 kill it because it bothers you and 1773 01:07:06,950 --> 01:07:03,760 so for an expert quote unquote 1774 01:07:09,430 --> 01:07:06,960 for the it bothers the anomalies of 1775 01:07:11,349 --> 01:07:09,440 bother him uh because they do not 1776 01:07:12,950 --> 01:07:11,359 conform with the kind of objects that he 1777 01:07:15,349 --> 01:07:12,960 knew about before 1778 01:07:17,270 --> 01:07:15,359 but that's the wrong approach to science 1779 01:07:19,190 --> 01:07:17,280 if something looks different that should 1780 01:07:20,870 --> 01:07:19,200 be intriguing that should be exciting 1781 01:07:21,750 --> 01:07:20,880 that's an opportunity to learn something 1782 01:07:24,150 --> 01:07:21,760 new 1783 01:07:25,750 --> 01:07:24,160 it's the wrong approach to everything 1784 01:07:27,750 --> 01:07:25,760 not just science 1785 01:07:31,190 --> 01:07:27,760 by the way science does not need to be 1786 01:07:35,670 --> 01:07:33,670 my point from day one was we can bring 1787 01:07:37,589 --> 01:07:35,680 more funds to science and the galileo 1788 01:07:39,990 --> 01:07:37,599 project is a proof of that and we can 1789 01:07:41,670 --> 01:07:40,000 attract more talent to science by 1790 01:07:43,270 --> 01:07:41,680 engaging with this question and the 1791 01:07:45,829 --> 01:07:43,280 galileo project is a 1792 01:07:47,109 --> 01:07:45,839 demonstration of that as well yeah well 1793 01:07:49,430 --> 01:07:47,119 i'm really proud of you for what it's 1794 01:07:52,230 --> 01:07:49,440 worth i know you don't need ego pets 1795 01:07:54,829 --> 01:07:52,240 because even though you have one you you 1796 01:07:58,150 --> 01:07:54,839 try not to acknowledge 1797 01:08:00,789 --> 01:07:58,160 it i appreciate it i mean i i can tell 1798 01:08:03,990 --> 01:08:00,799 you an anecdote that 1799 01:08:06,390 --> 01:08:04,000 my publicist in england when my book 1800 01:08:07,270 --> 01:08:06,400 came out he wrote an email to me and 1801 01:08:09,589 --> 01:08:07,280 said 1802 01:08:11,510 --> 01:08:09,599 great job avi you are 1803 01:08:14,309 --> 01:08:11,520 doing a great job in promoting the book 1804 01:08:15,349 --> 01:08:14,319 it sells very well and i corrected him i 1805 01:08:17,110 --> 01:08:15,359 said look 1806 01:08:19,110 --> 01:08:17,120 i'm not trying to sell my book i don't 1807 01:08:21,269 --> 01:08:19,120 care about that i'm just trying to 1808 01:08:23,590 --> 01:08:21,279 convey a message and the fact that the 1809 01:08:24,870 --> 01:08:23,600 book is being is being read by a lot of 1810 01:08:26,870 --> 01:08:24,880 people 1811 01:08:29,990 --> 01:08:26,880 is an indication that it appeals to the 1812 01:08:31,269 --> 01:08:30,000 public and if the public wouldn't like 1813 01:08:32,950 --> 01:08:31,279 my message 1814 01:08:35,030 --> 01:08:32,960 i would care less you know about it 1815 01:08:37,510 --> 01:08:35,040 because i don't i'm not after 1816 01:08:39,590 --> 01:08:37,520 being liked on twitter i'm not after 1817 01:08:41,189 --> 01:08:39,600 selling more copies of my book this is 1818 01:08:44,390 --> 01:08:41,199 not really my 1819 01:08:47,030 --> 01:08:44,400 uh motivation i i believe that you know 1820 01:08:49,110 --> 01:08:47,040 this study that we are involved in with 1821 01:08:51,510 --> 01:08:49,120 the galileo project and and and the 1822 01:08:53,749 --> 01:08:51,520 message that i got from omua muah these 1823 01:08:54,870 --> 01:08:53,759 are important things for people to 1824 01:08:57,749 --> 01:08:54,880 understand 1825 01:08:59,910 --> 01:08:57,759 as we move forward and then 1826 01:09:02,870 --> 01:08:59,920 you know the fact that people like it is 1827 01:09:04,390 --> 01:09:02,880 a pleasant surprise if people wouldn't 1828 01:09:05,749 --> 01:09:04,400 like it 1829 01:09:07,990 --> 01:09:05,759 i wouldn't care less i would still 1830 01:09:09,749 --> 01:09:08,000 deliver the same message 1831 01:09:11,969 --> 01:09:09,759 now i heard you just say you got a 1832 01:09:14,470 --> 01:09:11,979 message from a muammar 1833 01:09:17,110 --> 01:09:14,480 [Laughter] 1834 01:09:19,349 --> 01:09:17,120 okay the message from a move 1835 01:09:20,390 --> 01:09:19,359 it's very simple the message is 1836 01:09:22,390 --> 01:09:20,400 get more 1837 01:09:25,110 --> 01:09:22,400 data on objects like me 1838 01:09:27,189 --> 01:09:25,120 you know because i'm weird i i'm i don't 1839 01:09:29,669 --> 01:09:27,199 look like things that you're used to 1840 01:09:31,990 --> 01:09:29,679 that's the myth yeah it's it's beautiful 1841 01:09:34,789 --> 01:09:32,000 how can the public um you know someone 1842 01:09:36,149 --> 01:09:34,799 like myself or or the people watching if 1843 01:09:38,070 --> 01:09:36,159 they wanted to 1844 01:09:39,910 --> 01:09:38,080 you know help support you in project 1845 01:09:42,950 --> 01:09:39,920 galileo what would be the best route for 1846 01:09:44,709 --> 01:09:42,960 them to do so right so if it's financial 1847 01:09:46,550 --> 01:09:44,719 support we have 1848 01:09:49,510 --> 01:09:46,560 on our website of the law project at 1849 01:09:51,829 --> 01:09:49,520 harvard university we have a link to a 1850 01:09:53,189 --> 01:09:51,839 path that allows you to donate funds to 1851 01:09:55,430 --> 01:09:53,199 the project 1852 01:09:56,630 --> 01:09:55,440 and if it's a matter of 1853 01:09:58,149 --> 01:09:56,640 helping with 1854 01:09:59,030 --> 01:09:58,159 your expertise 1855 01:10:01,189 --> 01:09:59,040 then 1856 01:10:03,270 --> 01:10:01,199 you just need to write to me an email 1857 01:10:04,790 --> 01:10:03,280 okay what kind of expertise would you be 1858 01:10:06,149 --> 01:10:04,800 looking for 1859 01:10:08,070 --> 01:10:06,159 well it's tech 1860 01:10:09,990 --> 01:10:08,080 most of the expertise we need is 1861 01:10:11,910 --> 01:10:10,000 technical in terms of 1862 01:10:13,430 --> 01:10:11,920 collecting the data so first of all we 1863 01:10:15,669 --> 01:10:13,440 have instruments you know telescope 1864 01:10:17,590 --> 01:10:15,679 systems that are collecting the data so 1865 01:10:19,669 --> 01:10:17,600 if someone has an engineering experience 1866 01:10:20,950 --> 01:10:19,679 that could be helpful someone has an 1867 01:10:22,790 --> 01:10:20,960 experience in 1868 01:10:24,550 --> 01:10:22,800 uh artificial intelligence machine 1869 01:10:26,390 --> 01:10:24,560 learning because we will use computer 1870 01:10:28,229 --> 01:10:26,400 algorithms to identify what kind of 1871 01:10:30,630 --> 01:10:28,239 objects we're looking at whether it's a 1872 01:10:34,470 --> 01:10:30,640 bird whether it's a drone or an airplane 1873 01:10:36,709 --> 01:10:34,480 so expertise in in computer science uh 1874 01:10:39,350 --> 01:10:36,719 or expertise in 1875 01:10:42,229 --> 01:10:39,360 data analysis and then you know all of 1876 01:10:44,950 --> 01:10:42,239 this would be extremely helpful we also 1877 01:10:47,189 --> 01:10:44,960 have a subgroup that is dealing with 1878 01:10:49,110 --> 01:10:47,199 societal implications you know that's 1879 01:10:50,310 --> 01:10:49,120 another aspect of 1880 01:10:52,070 --> 01:10:50,320 what to do 1881 01:10:54,790 --> 01:10:52,080 if we do find something you know what 1882 01:10:57,510 --> 01:10:54,800 will be the implications to society 1883 01:11:00,550 --> 01:10:57,520 but that's a secondary topic the main 1884 01:11:01,990 --> 01:11:00,560 topic is first collecting the data and 1885 01:11:04,070 --> 01:11:02,000 analyzing it 1886 01:11:06,310 --> 01:11:04,080 and 1887 01:11:08,070 --> 01:11:06,320 my hope is that 1888 01:11:09,910 --> 01:11:08,080 in the spring we will have the first 1889 01:11:12,550 --> 01:11:09,920 telescope system on the roof of the 1890 01:11:14,149 --> 01:11:12,560 center for astrophysics 1891 01:11:16,149 --> 01:11:14,159 on the harvard campus 1892 01:11:19,189 --> 01:11:16,159 and then once it works according to the 1893 01:11:21,590 --> 01:11:19,199 specifications we will make copies of it 1894 01:11:23,669 --> 01:11:21,600 and the number of copies we make depends 1895 01:11:24,709 --> 01:11:23,679 on how much funding we have so currently 1896 01:11:26,790 --> 01:11:24,719 i have 1897 01:11:29,590 --> 01:11:26,800 close to two million dollars that that 1898 01:11:30,470 --> 01:11:29,600 would allow us to build perhaps five to 1899 01:11:33,110 --> 01:11:30,480 ten 1900 01:11:35,669 --> 01:11:33,120 telescope systems but that's too little 1901 01:11:37,830 --> 01:11:35,679 we we really need hundreds of them and 1902 01:11:40,630 --> 01:11:37,840 my hope is to raise about a hundred 1903 01:11:42,149 --> 01:11:40,640 million dollars that's the target okay 1904 01:11:44,470 --> 01:11:42,159 well i wish you the best of luck for 1905 01:11:46,870 --> 01:11:44,480 that uh with that if if you need any 1906 01:11:48,070 --> 01:11:46,880 help i'm an expert fundraiser 1907 01:11:50,229 --> 01:11:48,080 oh okay 1908 01:11:52,390 --> 01:11:50,239 just so you know um but i think you got 1909 01:11:54,630 --> 01:11:52,400 everybody's backing so if you just keep 1910 01:11:55,830 --> 01:11:54,640 being you living with integrity going 1911 01:11:58,390 --> 01:11:55,840 after things 1912 01:12:01,030 --> 01:11:58,400 um that you know we should be going 1913 01:12:02,709 --> 01:12:01,040 after i i think you know the universe 1914 01:12:04,390 --> 01:12:02,719 may have a way of taking care of people 1915 01:12:06,310 --> 01:12:04,400 like that so 1916 01:12:09,189 --> 01:12:06,320 thank you so much 1917 01:12:10,550 --> 01:12:09,199 great strength to hear these things 1918 01:12:13,110 --> 01:12:10,560 because as you know there are also 1919 01:12:15,910 --> 01:12:13,120 people trying to sabotage this 1920 01:12:17,830 --> 01:12:15,920 yeah i know um you're not alone in it 1921 01:12:19,270 --> 01:12:17,840 though you have a lot of people that are 1922 01:12:21,510 --> 01:12:19,280 rooting for you and have your back 1923 01:12:23,830 --> 01:12:21,520 whatever it is you may need even if we 1924 01:12:25,590 --> 01:12:23,840 can't help know that you have our hearts 1925 01:12:27,590 --> 01:12:25,600 and and our 1926 01:12:29,750 --> 01:12:27,600 grace and our compassion 1927 01:12:31,750 --> 01:12:29,760 and whatever else we can do so thank you 1928 01:12:34,390 --> 01:12:31,760 thank you so much i'll do my best to 1929 01:12:36,790 --> 01:12:34,400 justify your trust 1930 01:12:38,950 --> 01:12:36,800 anything else you want to say um i would 1931 01:12:40,470 --> 01:12:38,960 imagine you may need some shut-eye 1932 01:12:42,870 --> 01:12:40,480 before you go write another book and 1933 01:12:45,189 --> 01:12:42,880 then find new aps well the only thing i 1934 01:12:46,790 --> 01:12:45,199 would say is that i enjoy working with 1935 01:12:48,630 --> 01:12:46,800 young people because they don't have 1936 01:12:50,070 --> 01:12:48,640 prejudice and 1937 01:12:51,830 --> 01:12:50,080 we have a lot of young people on the 1938 01:12:53,750 --> 01:12:51,840 team and um 1939 01:12:55,750 --> 01:12:53,760 it's really refreshing you know we have 1940 01:12:57,669 --> 01:12:55,760 four undergraduates just from harvard 1941 01:12:59,669 --> 01:12:57,679 that came to me and said we would like 1942 01:13:00,709 --> 01:12:59,679 to be engaged in the project and 1943 01:13:02,390 --> 01:13:00,719 and 1944 01:13:04,630 --> 01:13:02,400 it's very refreshing for me to see young 1945 01:13:06,470 --> 01:13:04,640 people that are not trapped 1946 01:13:08,630 --> 01:13:06,480 in the same mindset as the older 1947 01:13:10,709 --> 01:13:08,640 generation so 1948 01:13:13,030 --> 01:13:10,719 once again you know i i'm very hopeful 1949 01:13:15,110 --> 01:13:13,040 for the future yeah 1950 01:13:16,709 --> 01:13:15,120 uh well you're setting the tone and 1951 01:13:19,110 --> 01:13:16,719 you're you're putting a good example out 1952 01:13:21,590 --> 01:13:19,120 there what you're looking for via alien 1953 01:13:24,870 --> 01:13:21,600 uh hardware you know 1954 01:13:26,390 --> 01:13:24,880 so we all need someone um thank you so 1955 01:13:27,830 --> 01:13:26,400 you know it makes me wish i would have 1956 01:13:29,990 --> 01:13:27,840 went to college so i could help you 1957 01:13:31,510 --> 01:13:30,000 there too but well uh i'll come back to 1958 01:13:34,550 --> 01:13:31,520 your show when we find something for 1959 01:13:36,149 --> 01:13:34,560 sure all right that's a deal 1960 01:13:38,870 --> 01:13:36,159 and if you ever change your mind and you 1961 01:13:41,669 --> 01:13:38,880 want to learn chess i can teach you that 1962 01:13:43,430 --> 01:13:41,679 i'm sure you're much better than me 1963 01:13:45,750 --> 01:13:43,440 all right professor you have a great 1964 01:13:47,430 --> 01:13:45,760 evening thank you so very much i hope 1965 01:13:49,910 --> 01:13:47,440 everything goes well with lou and chris 1966 01:13:52,390 --> 01:13:49,920 and and the amendment and everything so 1967 01:13:54,470 --> 01:13:52,400 um we're rooting for you fingers crossed 1968 01:13:57,110 --> 01:13:54,480 thank you yep all right take care 1969 01:13:58,870 --> 01:13:57,120 bye-bye bye 1970 01:14:03,189 --> 01:13:58,880 all right that was a fantastic time with 1971 01:14:04,149 --> 01:14:03,199 mr avi loeb um and we will see you 1972 01:14:05,590 --> 01:14:04,159 too 1973 01:14:07,910 --> 01:14:05,600 tomorrow 1974 01:14:11,189 --> 01:14:07,920 um i really appreciate your time and you 1975 01:14:13,030 --> 01:14:11,199 guys hanging out and being a great crowd 1976 01:14:14,470 --> 01:14:13,040 um 1977 01:14:16,950 --> 01:14:14,480 and just your support 1978 01:14:19,590 --> 01:14:16,960 um avi's a great guy i think we had a 1979 01:14:22,070 --> 01:14:19,600 great discussion 1980 01:14:24,229 --> 01:14:22,080 um he's genuine 1981 01:14:27,669 --> 01:14:24,239 most definitely 1982 01:14:29,189 --> 01:14:27,679 um his heart's in the right place 1983 01:14:31,270 --> 01:14:29,199 you know you gotta love somebody who 1984 01:14:34,149 --> 01:14:31,280 just wants to do good things and for the 1985 01:14:36,950 --> 01:14:34,159 sake of doing good things for others 1986 01:14:38,870 --> 01:14:36,960 so and he's in that camp so with that 1987 01:14:40,950 --> 01:14:38,880 being said 1988 01:14:43,189 --> 01:14:40,960 i'm gonna get home 1989 01:14:45,750 --> 01:14:43,199 eat some food do my thing 1990 01:14:49,430 --> 01:14:45,760 um and y'all take care 1991 01:14:50,790 --> 01:14:49,440 by the way december 17th and uap secrecy 1992 01:14:54,550 --> 01:14:50,800 day 1993 01:15:00,880 --> 01:14:54,560 big eight hour show here on this channel